Welcome to another fun-filled edition of Shitbox Showdown! Today, we’re looking at two examples of the same car. I found them within minutes of each other, and they each fill in gaps in each other’s shortcomings. So we’re going to do the traditional either/or vote, but I’m also going to add in the rarely-seen “Both” option.
But before we get to those, let’s see which melee weapon you chose yesterday. I had a feeling I knew which one was going to win, by virtue of it being both cheaper and in better condition, and I was right. The potential cigarette smell in the Buick put a lot of you off, and it would put me off too. That Buick was my second choice for yesterday, actually; I was going to feature a really nice Cutlass Ciera wagon, but it was for sale at a buy-here-pay-here lot, and they did that stupid thing where they add a banner with their phone number to every image. So Smokey the Buick got the nod… and lost.
It’s one of the many pitfalls I face each and every day to bring you the finest in crappy old cars. Often, I find a car I really want to feature, but it has one or two bad photos, or twenty photos but all close-ups, or nothing but iPhone screen shots. Honestly, after doing this job, I could teach a class in how not to take photos for a classified ad.
All right; let’s talk Jeeps. After World War II, civilian Jeeps were more or less the same as military ones, meaning tough, rough, and mostly bare steel. But with competition from International and others making more comfortable and car-like vehicles, a more civilized Jeep was needed. Enter the Wagoneer. This big four-door wagon had a long lifespan, lasting from 1963 all the way until 1991 – that’s three owners of the Jeep name. Today we have one from the Kaiser era, and one from the AMC years. Let’s check them out.
1970 Jeep Wagoneer – $2,600
Engine/drivetrain: 350 cubic inch overhead valve V8, three-speed automatic, part-time 4WD
Location: Eagle Creek, OR
Odometer reading: 100,000 miles
Runs/drives? Runs, but not roadworthy
One of my favorite things about writing this column is that I get to learn stuff I never knew about all sorts of cars. For example, I had no idea that the first Jeep Wagoneers were available with independent front suspension and an overhead-cam inline six. Sophisticated stuff for 1963. Both options were gone by the time this Wagoneer was built in 1970, likely due to cost reasons. This one has a simple solid axle on leaf springs, like the Jeep CJ, and a Buick-built 350 cubic inch V8. I assumed the Buick engine was just a case of “let’s throw in whatever’s lying around to get this thing running,” but no; it came that way from the factory.
This one runs fine, and the Turbo-Hydramatic 400 transmission shifts fine, and you can drive it around a little. But it’s not what you’d call roadworthy – it has a new alternator but no belt for it, and the cooling system is empty, probably after some other recent work. There is also the small matter of the driver’s seat, or rather, the lack of one. Or any interior at all, for that matter.
That’s not all that’s missing: the grille, headlights, taillights, and tailgate are also gone. And I think we have to assume that gone means gone; the seller makes no mention of any of that stuff being included. The bare interior lets you see the rust damage; it isn’t bad, but it does need some work on the floors.
But apart from the floors, this doesn’t look like a rustbucket. It looks like it could be saved, if you could find the missing parts. It already runs and moves under its own power, so that’s a good first step.
1979 Jeep Wagoneer – $2,500
Engine/drivetrain: 360 cubic inch overhead valve V8, three-speed automatic, full-time 4WD
Location: Tillamook, OR
Odometer reading: 144,000 miles
Runs/drives? Nope, had an engine fire
And speaking of those missing parts, look at what we have here: a complete but rusty 1979 Wagoneer. This one has the classic fake woodgrain sides, a saddle-tan interior, and all its exterior trim. It also has David’s favorite engine – the nearly-useless AMC 360 V8, backed by a Chrysler Torqueflite automatic and a full-time 4WD Quadra-Trac transfer case. David’s hatred of this engine is vindicated in this case – it has suffered an engine fire. The seller has started trying to fix it; it looks like the carburetor is new, and the seller says they have a new wiring harness for it, but no longer has time to work on it.
Apart from the obvious engine damage, this Jeep has some pretty serious rust damage; the rocker panels are shot, the fenderwells are rusting through, and there’s the fire damage to the hood, of course. With the corners and rocker panels as bad as they are, I can only imagine what the floors are like.
The interior isn’t perfect, but it is there. AMC interiors were always sort of cheap and flimsy, but comfortable. This one is missing a window crank – they all seem to be – and has some tears in the driver’s seat, but otherwise looks all right.
You could continue the work the seller has started, and bring this Wagoneer back to life, probably without too much trouble. But it will still be rusty. I think the right call here might be to buy both, and transfer parts over to the ’70 shell with the good-running Buick engine. I think there are enough parts here between these two to make one pretty good Wagoneer. It won’t be a showpiece, but it could be a good-running, decent-looking truck for a lot less than the insane asking prices that clean Wagoneers are commanding these days.
Or, you could take the ’70 and turn it into an off-road beast, or tackle the rust and the engine work on the ’79 and try to flip it for some outrageous price. The choice is yours.
(Image credits: Craigslist sellers)
Gimme the one with wood.
I’d put an EcoBoost & 10 speed from a wrecked F150 into it.
Or a V12 from a wrecked Ferrari.
Either one.
Two cars David would describe as “runs great” and “near mint,” respectively.
I think this is a great article idea for the Autopian. You should pitch it.
The people who post those shit ads can’t spend 10 seconds taking a picture, you think they’re going to read something? Gross
Everybody wants one of these until they have to actually live with it. It’s been 20+ yrs but my buddies dad had to have one around 2000ish…you know the type. 50 yr old dad that wears blue jeans and denim jackets and still uses a backpack. Rare jazz and blues albums in the basement and a vintage BMW motorcycle and a Shopsmith in the garage and neither really get used much.
He paid a lot of money for a rust free Wagoneer in Minnesota that had been thoroughly gone through. The thing is, even a thoroughly gone through 360 still requires that you drive around with a can of ether and wrenches. Even when it’s running “good” you’re going to smell like gasoline when you get out of it.
He dealt with the hassles for around five years before he threw in the towel and moved on to a Triumph convertible if you want an idea of what kind of headache an old Wagoneer is.
Also it’s worth mentioning that all of these vehicles were “nostalgia” based fun cars, his daily driver was a toyota 4 runner.
Fuck and no. Push them both off a cliff.
Mark! Think of David Tracy!! This is the Autopian equivalent of leaving a bag of cocaine on the front doorstep of an 80’s lawyer! The temptation will be insurmountable and one of these is going to end up in the Autopian’s parking lot to be the next home of several more kittens.
There’s a missing option here:
Neither. Neither has enough going for it for me to even want to start in on it at that price. There have to be better examples.
As fussy as I am about a car providing somewhere to sit whilst it transports you were you want to go I’m taking the 70. At least it runs.
In the late 90s I briefly had a 1960s Wagoneer that was complete and roadworthy, same body style and steel interior as that 1970. I bought it for $1200. I didn’t (and don’t) know anything about these trucks, I just thought it looked cool. I was told mine had a Kaiser V8? Is that a thing? It was perfect for transporting band gear to local shows. Dumbass that I am, I sold it at a loss because there was some crappy motorcycle I wanted instead.
WOODIE!
That is all.
Wood not.
I’ll take the 79. Despite David’s rant about the 360, I find it pretty easy to tinker on, and parts availability is pretty good on FSJ’s (Thanks BJ’s offroad). AMC throwing parts from other makes can complicate things, but its not as bad as IH stuff. I am biased though, I have a 77 Cherokee with a 360 and quadratrac. PS that 79 almost certainly has a TH400 in it, I think its the only trans you could get the full time 4wd with.
Not as bad as IH stuff? I think Jeep was following the same basic formula IH was at the time RE running gear. And if you do just a little research you can find almost anything you need.
Later Grand Wagoneers had full time 4wd too, but it was a different system (not Quadra-Trac) and also offered selectable 2wd.
I’ve got a 1991 and it has selectable full time 4wd with a TF727 transmission.
“Both” is the obvious choice here. Given AMC’s notorious cheapness–I mean, their remarkable thrift–surely anything from the ’79 would fit on the ’70.
Do it. I’ve read some articles like that over the years and still seem to do a shitty job when im trying to sell something
True Story: In the early 90’s my dad had a run of rust bucket cars that got him from point a to b. One was a Grand Wagoneer from the AMC era (much like the one pictured here). While driving the whole family somewhere one Saturday, the engine caught fire. He pulled over, we all got out and he took out his trusty fire extinguisher, put out the fire and we went on our way. He sold it. It too long after to someone who paid way more than it was worth.
To this day he maintains: Putting that fire out was the biggest mistake he ever made with that vehicle. “I should have just let it burn on the side of the road. After I put the fire out, I questioned: why?”
So here’s the deal – the relative condition between the two doesn’t matter that much, because in California I would have to smog the ’79 and I wouldn’t have to deal with that on the ’70. The play for a California owner is to take the parts you can from the ’79 and put them in the ’70. With the ridiculous pricing on SJs these days it’s not the worst option.
Before I even read the article I wanted to get both and make them one. A pre-smog Buick 350 V8?! Yes please.
$2500/$2600 for this shit? Haw haw haw haw haw haw…*choke* *sniff*…
Restored Wagoneers go for crazy money. I went with the 79, because I think it would be the easier of the two to restore.
For the right person, both is the answer. I am not that person, however if I had the time/money/space/skill I’d be tempted to make a run of it.
I don’t think you could get one that’s nicer than the end result of the two of these for the $5100 you’d spend on the pair. Having a parts rig for the miscellaneous stuff is nice too.
I could swear I saw both of these on a car carrier in LA
Headed for indefinite storage at Galpin?
There are kittens that are in need of a home.
99% sure a 1979 Quadratrac has the TH400 as well. Parts availability all around is better for the 79. If you go stock it’s Ford ignition unlike the 75-77 Prestolite. Or you just drop in the LS. Not sure how the 70 is better in any way.
Ugh, this is the rarity where I abstain because they’re both way more work than they’re worth.
I forced myself to vote for one (the 79), but both of these junkyard specials are way too much money. I really like the body style of the 70, but there isn’t enough there for $2600. Over $5 for a garage full of bad Jeep parts isn’t worth it, so I avoided the both option.
I’m an idiot, so therefore I am voting ‘both’. I would rationalize it saying that I could flip one for a lot of money but if I were honest with myself, I would say that the body work involved is beyond my skill level. I could get them both running and mechanically sound but can’t do the bodywork.
Buying both and moving the exterior trim and full interior from the Roman candle to the Mad Max special is the right move. The body rust on our crispy critter makes it a project for someone who is willing to do a shit load of cutting and welding in addition to swapping power trains. Ain’t nobody got time for that!