Who’d have thought that after all the hype battery electric vehicles have generated over the past decade, hybrids would be dominating the current news cycle? It turns out that adding a little electric assistance to normal cars can work out to be a whole lot cheaper than building dedicated EVs, yet still cut carbon emissions.
At the same time, views on the future of hybrids are divided. Some automakers believe partial electrification is here to stay, while others are of the opinion that it’s battery power or bust. Ford seems to be in the former camp and GM the latter.
Plus, insight into the midsize sedan’s decline, action over allegations of child labor at a Hyundai supplier, and Renault partnering with a Chinese juggernaut on hybrid powertrain development. It’s all right here on The Morning Dump.
Ford and GM Have Different Perspectives On The Future Of Hybrids
Neither Ford nor General Motors are strangers to electrification, but it seems like the automakers’ long-term plans for partial electrification are set to diverge. The Detroit Free Press reports that the two automakers have different views on hybrids, with Ford seeing the technology as more than just temporary.
“We should stop talking about it as transitional technology,” Farley said of hybrids at the Bernstein Annual Strategic Decisions Conference. “Many of our hybrids in the U.S. are now more profitable than their non-hybrid equivalent,” Farley added.
Plug-in hybrids, which include a small battery that can be used for shorter distances, may not be relevant in a few years, Farley said. However, extended-range hybrids are an important technology for the industry’s future, he said.
Farley appears to be talking about extended-range electric vehicles, like David’s i3s REX or the incoming Ram 1500 Ramcharger with its big battery pack and Pentastar V6 generator. Vehicles where the combustion engine doesn’t drive the wheels, but instead backs up the battery pack for longer trips and more energy-intensive use.
At the same time, although General Motors will be bringing plug-in hybrids back to its North American lineup, CEO Mary Barra still seems to see hybrids as transitional technology, with the Detroit Free Press noting:
Barra said the Detroit automaker will have plug-in hybrids starting in 2027, in response to steeper regulatory requirements, but electric vehicles are where GM sees the market heading.
“It’s not the end game because it’s not zero emission,” Barra said of hybrids at the same conference. “We’re trying to be very smart about how we do that and how we deploy capital there,” she added.
Here’s the thing: In some segments, plug-in hybrids and extended-range electric vehicles will essentially need to be long-term solutions. Battery electric vehicles are simply too efficient to get decent range while towing, and without a breakthrough in battery technology, some form of combustion assistance simply makes sense for people who use their trucks as trucks.
It’s also worth noting that human beings are bold and optimistic, eager to latch onto extreme goals without a guaranteed plan of how to get there. Proposed 2035 bans on new combustion-powered cars are only a decade away, and while we’ll certainly make progress with infrastructure and BEV affordability in the next 10 years, whether or not we make enough progress is yet to be seen. There’s a chance either of these strategies could succeed in the long run, so let’s set a reminder in our calendars to check back in 2035 and see how things played out.
And Then There Were Five
In 2010, American customers could choose between 20 different midsize sedan nameplates. Next year, that number will fall to five as the Subaru Legacy and Chevrolet Malibu bow out of the market, and while there’s a chance the remaining players will scoop up newly available market share, it’s no guarantee. As Automotive News reports:
The Automotive News Research & Data Center has tracked U.S. sales of every midsize sedan nameplate since 2009. As recently as 2012, midsize sedans commanded 16.7 percent of the U.S. market, or 2,424,213 vehicles. In 2023, share fell to 5.7 percent, or 884,949.
While 2023’s total midsize sedan sales are up slightly over 2022’s figures, market share is still down as crossovers continue to dominate everything. Besides, this has been a long time coming. Midsize sedan sales fell below 2009 numbers in 2018, and that should’ve been a sign considering how 2009 wasn’t the greatest year for car sales. America was still reeling from the Great Recession, and mainstream customers were tightening their belts rather than splashing out on new vehicles. In fact, 2009 saw the fewest new light vehicle sales since 1982, a mere 10.4 million in America.
Really, the decline of midsize sedans makes sense. Crossovers are incredibly convenient, get better fuel economy than ever, and have proven themselves more effective as family transportation. Raising kids sometimes involves transporting bulky stuff that just wouldn’t fit in a sedan, and there’s undeniable appeal in having one vehicle to do it all.
The Feds Are Suing Hyundai Over Those Child Labor Allegations
Remember how Reuters reported in 2022 that a Hyundai supplier in Alabama was using child labor? Well, it seems like something’s finally happening on that front. Earlier this week, Reuters reported that the Department of Labor is taking Hyundai to court over allegations of child labor usage at a stamping supplier for the automaker’s Alabama plant.
The Labor Department filing named three companies as defendants for employing a 13-year-old child: Hyundai Motor Manufacturing Alabama LLC; SMART Alabama LLC, an auto parts company; and Best Practice Service LLC, a staffing firm.
The Department’s Wage and Hour Division found the child had worked up to 60 hours per week on a SMART assembly line operating machines that formed sheet metal into auto parts.
Needless to say, children shouldn’t be working in sheet metal stamping plants, and since SMART was a Hyundai subsidiary while this was allegedly going on, it makes sense that the automaker is named in the suit. While legal action of this sort usually ends in a settlement, let’s see how this one plays out.
Renault Teams Up With Geely For Hybrids
The next few years will foster some interesting alliances between automakers, and here’s one people weren’t expecting: Renault is teaming up with Geely to build hybrid powertrains. You know, the Chinese firm that owns Volvo and Lotus. As Reuters reports:
“A combination of various powertrain technologies is necessary … to achieve a successful decarbonization in a world where more than half of vehicles produced are expected to still rely on combustion engines by 2040,” Renault and Geely said in a joint statement.
The venture, dubbed HORSE Powertrain, will be headquartered in London and will supply both the groups’ brands as well as third-party manufacturers.
Hang on — doesn’t the Renault Nissan Mitsubishi Alliance include at least two interesting hybrid systems? Well, yes, but the alliance doesn’t quite seem to work like that. Although some level of sharing is in effect, pride has always been a divisive part of this existing partnership. Will any of these new powertrains make it to America under the hoods of Nissans? That’s yet to be seen, but don’t count it out just yet.
What I’m Listening To While Writing TMD
Fred Again… just dropped a new track with Anderson .Paak and CHIKA today, and yep, he’s done it again. Just a wonderfully vibey track perfect for dropping the top and savoring some warm weather. Funnily enough, I’ve ended up with last-minute evening plans involving Nakai-san of RWB fame and Patois, so at some point later today, I’ll be firing up the Boxster and likely putting this on the stereo.
The Big Question
How’s your charging situation at home? Do you already have a convenient NEMA outlet in your garage, are you in an underground car park with no way of charging, or are you somewhere in between?
(Photo credits: Ford, Chevrolet, Toyota, Hyundai, Renault)
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I have a single car wide driveway, so while I have a detached garage, having the charger be in the garage would be massively inconvenient, as I’m usually the first to leave and the last to get home every day. It doesn’t help that I live on a busy street, so switching the cars around is pretty excruciating. Whatever I’d be using to charge (someday) will need to be outside. Not exactly ideal.
I don’t have any intention of installing a charging solution until I purchase a PHEV or EV, but that’s likely well down the road. When I do, it’s going to be a fairly difficult thing to figure out logistically, as I DO NOT want to deal with having to switch cars around to be able to charge the car.
FYI. You can buy lots of EV chargers that are rated to be installed outdoors. I have an outdoor rated Leviton 240V/32A charger that has been outside for 12 years without issue.
Yeah I know that outside is an option, but I think my issue is more where will my vehicle be outside when it’s parked. Maybe I’m a fringe case, but based on my driveway being a single car wide, often sharing the driveway with 2 other vehicles, and often needing to avoid the parts of my driveway that snow falls on, I would probably need a 50ft cable to reach my car in certain situations.
I’m single driveway, two electric cars, snow belt. Just make sure you get a 240V charger with a 25foot charging cable (a lot are just 18ft or even 15ft). It offers a lot of flexibility reaching both cars.
25ft might work with some effort. Charge port location certainly has an impact as well.
Snow belt huh? What sort of temps we talking about? What sort of ranges are you getting in arctic temps?
We would have hated having an 18ft cord. That 25ft cord adds a LOT of flexibility. I highly recommend. Also look for a brand that explicitly mentions a charge cord that stays flexible in cold weather. The Leviton charger cord is still reasonably flexible in cold weather.
-5 to -25C. 24 to -13F in that weird temperature system that I don’t use. 🙂
When -25C losing 30-40% range. When -5C 25-30%. The car uses resistive heating – it would be quite a bit better with a heat pump I suspect.
This is a 12 year old EV this December. In the summer I have lost 10-15% range from new.
Those are fairly reasonable results especially for a 12 year old EV. Good to know.
We have a home EV charger. We bought it and a used EV partly with rebates from going solar on our house. The car was an inexpensive way to try EV. It has been dead reliable and also dead boring. I’ve listed the car for sale and am now realizing that it might be impossible to sell a used EV, even with a new battery replaced under warranty. Why would I go buy another very expensive one? And I have not ever leased/rented cars. We bought a 2022 Civic Si manual that gets good MPG and is engaging to drive.
I installed a 6-20R (240v, 20A) in 2015 for my Volt. I plug a TurboCord into that for 16A charging which was the fastest the Volt could charge. Now that I also have a Bolt I still use the same TurboCord and honestly it’s plenty fast enough for me. It will pretty much do the car overnight unless I roll in super dead.
Since we have a plug-in hybrid, a simple 110v outlet is all we need. But of course the socket is on the left side of the garage, and the charge port on the Rav4 is on the right side. So, I had to rig a series of holders to run the cord over the top to the far side. Just a minor nuisance. Considering having a proper outlet plumbed to a more convenient location, but not running the 220v there. Leave that to the next owners as we plan to move in a few years.
Two Wallbox 40A Level 2 chargers wired in my garage that were part of the solar installation + one 110V 12A outlet outside in case I don’t need a full charge for the next morning. I like that I can adjust the output of the Level 2 chargers to the output of the solar generation, that way I dont sell back to the electric company for peanuts compare to what they charge.
The guy I bought my Volt from gave me a Bosch EVSE for level 2 charging. It’s been in use since 2016. I’ve got it plugged into into a 50-amp wall outlet, but would like to hard wire it at some point so I don’t have to unplug it when I want to use the large air compressor. When the Volt dies, there’s a good chance I’ll be replacing it with a used Bolt, so I’m hoping to otherwise leave it as it is for awhile.
As to those kids in Alabama, it’s good Hyundai is being investigated. That said, I would have loved to have worked someplace like that at that age. I started working in an auto-body shop when I was 12, for a hefty $2.50/hr. cash (when minimum wage was $4.00) that wasn’t even paid regularly by the gambling-addict owner of the place. I was thrilled just to be there at first, but didn’t realize for awhile I was being taken advantage of. Granted, the owner not paying me for 60 hours of work did kind of help speed up that realization.
Could have been worse. You like many young folks today could have been an unpaid intern without even the expectation of that $2.50/hr, only the “experience* and maybe a boilerplate letter of recommendation as your only compensation.
Or any of the myriad folks in the creative arts offered to paid in “exposure”.
So many times I’ve heard that shit that I immediately tell everyone else I know. Usually within a few weeks the person either retracts the “work” or actually is willing to start paying.
One of my favorite versions of this was a bunch of years ago witnessing my roommate get a commission for some basic web-site graphics. A few hundred dollars for some assorted graphics for a company website, straightforward enough. That quickly turned into designing the whole site and providing the written content as well, but no extra money – only the promise to pay out the original amount upon completion.
Then it got really fun – their marketing guy (who came to our house in person) actually asked him to paint three or four original paintings for their lobby, for “Exposure” of course. This was some type of data storage place, located underground, and part of their whole schtick about being a secure place to store data was that no one ever went there. “Exposure” indeed. My roommate finally bailed on the whole thing and of course never was actually paid for any of the original graphics he did provide.
To keep the slow-cooking cataclysm that is climate change to a tolerable level of nightmarish, we have to throttle down all fossil fuel usage by >90% by the mid-to-late 2040s. If vast numbers of gas cars are still on the road when it’s time to stop drilling, we’ll be stuck between a rock and a hard place — keep drilling and the climate gets exponentially worse, or stop drilling and nobody can get to work. Banning new gas engines by 2035 lets the cars age out before the deadline. It isn’t an extreme goal, it’s the gentlest, least ambitious possible solution that keeps us out of that rock/hard place scenario.
Hybrids are transitional tech: they get fast results that buy us time (doubly so for PHEVs), but they’re still crippled without fossil fuels. You know what’s wildly bold and optimistic with no realistic plan for how to get there? Saying that hybrids are not a transitional tech, and that some magic bullet (probably carbon capture) will materialize so we can keep drilling or synthesizing automotive fuel perpetually.
The climate will get more extreme, but we will adapt. The reality is people won’t give up their quality of life to fight climate change.
Their quality of life will suffer much more due to climate change. As far as us adapting, there are legit climate models that suggest we’re headed into a runaway greenhouse effect that nobody will survive.
No credible models predict that. That’s just alarmist nonsense.
Damn! And I just closed escrow on my undersea domicile.
It’s probable no humans will survive. We’re adaptable, but you can’t engineer your way out of an exponential resource shortage. It’s likely plenty arthropods will survive. Highly unlikely most sea life, avians, or mammals will. Reptiles are hard to predict as they have a history of staying unchanged for massive periods of time and then evolving quickly under extreme conditions. We’re definitely going to see a massive reduction in diversity when it comes to flora, which is going to cause the first and main stage of population collapse among the different animal types. Mass plankton blooms and algae die off as the oceans warm are likely going to shift the atmosphere into a state hostile to everything, including causing ozone depletion as there won’t be enough oxygen transitioning through the ozone-oxygen cycle, meaning we lose or significantly weaken our UV and cosmic radiation shield.
Things aren’t looking great.
It’s not probable at all. The alarmists are as bad as the deniers.
From what I remember being taught about relative measurements, unlikely is 1-25%, probable is 26-50%, likely is 51-75%, and certain is 76-100%. In our case we’d invert these since we’re talking about negative probability. So saying we have at worst a 25% chance and at best a 50% chance of surviving the climate disaster beyond the year 2100 sounds about right.
Things have already gotten insane twenty four years into this century. We’ve already hit the atmospheric carbon tipping point and we’ve already hit the oceanic oxygen diffusion tipping point. We’d have to hit negative numbers for a decade straight globally by doing carbon capture just to stall progression. Unless we do some comical Futurama level engineering of developing a giant foil wrapper for a third of the Earth or similar the temperatures are going to continue to rise faster than current ecosystems can deal with them. Just in North America we’ve already lost the Nova Scotia fish spawns because the ocean temperatures are too warm to replace what we overfished in the 1980s, then with the heat island effect from suburban and exurban sprawl building huge parking lots and highways it fucks up weather patterns so bad it affects regional climates where it creates droughts locally and floods in areas east of those local droughts, and without cold water to trap more oxygen the Atlantic creates more violent hurricanes as the storm patterns don’t need as much energy to evaporate the water.
Being an alarmist would be me saying that we all need to move to bunkers. I’m being a bit pessimistic, but still a realist by saying we fucked up to the point where we can’t stop it, or at the very least return to pre-2000 climates globally.
Which fish spawns have stopped in Nova Scotia?
Both Atlantic cod and striped bass have fallen below replacement rate again, the Atlantic mackerel has been below replacement rate along Canada’s coast for years, and the Atlantic whitefish is on the threshold of extinction partially because it has no ocean spawns anymore. The Atlantic Whitefish used to be an estuary and delta fish found from Newfoundland down to Maine, but it’s only found in a few lakes in Nova Scotia now. The mackerel situation is really dire because they’re prey animals of a lot of the local ecosystem along the Eastern Canadian and Northeastern American coastline, and after humans overfished the adult population those predators have wiped out fry or young fish from Nova Scotia’s coastal waters before they could reproduce. That loss of mackerel affects seals, sharks, pike, orcas, pilot whales, and plenty of others because it either pushes them further south or east in summer.
The cod situation has been ongoing for 30+ years. There are tons of stripers here, lots of mackerel too, but they are somewhat smaller. I can catch a mackerel in 3 minutes from any ocean warf.
I’m in Nova Scotia. The fish are still here and spawning. Overfishing is causing the issues. Not climate change.
If you’ve got some numbers or links from your province’s department of natural resources I’d be extremely thankful. It’s difficult to find that stuff because for some reason the American internet and search engines tend to make it difficult looking for anything that isn’t American hosted or an SEO topic, so I can’t find any catch maps on the DFO’s website. Making it worse is that a lot of English scientific journals that aren’t behind paywalls use U.S. “refinements” of data gathered internationally and I’m always a bit skeptical of them. Like the supposed sudden polar bear population explosion or the supposed population collapse of invasive lionfish around St. Lucia and Martinique as recent examples.
And yeah, the overfishing decimated the population, but the traditional spawning grounds of a lot of those fish have become hostile because the temperature and oxygenation conditions that would’ve normally fostered them until they were adults have either drastically shortened or disappeared. Despite the move to downsize fleet sizes without as much of a move to supertrawlers on the western half of the Atlantic in place of a transition to mass catch off the coasts of Alaska up north and Argentina and Chile down south there hasn’t been any indication of the overfished populations recovering much.
The question is whether you can adapt faster to a thing than it can kill you. Some things, not so much.
I’ve got a 60A 240V outlet for a welder/plasma cutter that I can also use for an EV charger (should I buy an EV or PHEV down the road). I also have several spare 50A breakers should I need to install more than one EV charger.
I mean…GM has a long and storied history of making the exact wrong decisions. Of course they’ve also made some good ones and developed many brilliant products along the way…but when it comes to major, potentially brand and industry altering ones they pretty reliably fuck up every single time, and I don’t think this will be an exception, especially since the Ultium platform cars they’re betting so heavily on are such pigs.
Anyway, we aren’t just going to eliminate ICE and emissions in the next decade. It’s literally impossible, and EV technology and adoption are still in their infancy. There are many applications that BEVs still won’t be appropriate for in 2035…which is roughly the same distance from us chronologically as the release of the Tesla Model S is, which was more or less the first fully viable and widely adapted EV. I’m the furthest thing from a Tesla stan but other manufacturers are essentially just recently catching up to what that car was offering over a decade ago.
All or nothing thinking gets us nowhere and it’s idiotic to throw out the good in pursuit of perfection, because perfection is impossible. What truly sucks about this situation is that the mass hybridization we’re seeing today could have begun 10-15 years ago…and if we had bans on ICE vehicles might not be be necessary and we’d likely be in a much less precarious place with the climate today.
In my humble opinion that’s where the real fuck up happened. As I’ve said several times, there is absolutely 0 reason for any appliance car not to be a hybrid. They’re better in every single way. They’re faster, more efficient, emit less, cost less to own in the first 100,000 or so miles, etc. Pure ICE appliances have no reason to exist anymore. Full ICE should be reserved for cars with sporting intentions and trucks at this stage.
Preach on Brother Nsane.
As a recovering perfectionist, ‘perfect is the enemy of good’ is the single best piece of advice I have ever come across. We would all do well to remember it.
And of course you’re right about hybridizing all the appliance vehicles. Note that should probably include even most trucks that aren’t dedicated long distance haulers. I’ll bet its 90% or more of vehicles this applies to, commercial included.
“there is absolutely 0 reason for any appliance car not to be a hybrid. They’re faster, more efficient, emit less, cost less to own in the first 100,000 or so miles, etc.”
I don’t see “own the libs” on that list which is a dealbreaker for far too many.
By the time 2027 rolls around, GM may not be going PHEV at all. As long as ICE continues to sell and EVs look viable in the next decade, I’m not sure GM will actually make a PHEV or at least one that people want to buy compared to other manufactures that really want to sell PHEV and hybrids.
GM’s montra of Zero Emissions, Zero Congestion, Zero Crashes.
Looks like they might achieve the Zero Emissions if they go all electric in the next 30 years or so.
Zero Congestion is probably only achievable through government regulation restricting vehicle ownership, catastrophic economic meltdown or only producing EVs that are sooo expensive only elites can afford them. OR all the above.
Zero Crashes. As long as there are vehicles on the road, whether autonomous or human driven, there will be crashes.
I put in a Siemens Versicharge Level 2 back in 2017. It’s still kicking. It’s rated for 32 amps, but I’ve never had a car that would charge at faster than 16A, since they were both PHEV’s (Volt and 330e). I have a 50A circuit at 240V running to the garage panel, and the garage panel is a 30 circuit 200 amp panel so there’s plenty of room for more circuits. I might need to up the power feed eventually.
I’m also on an EV whole house time of day rate, so I have cheap rates at night and all weekend, but pay more between 11am and 7pm M-F. That works well for me and I’m typically around 85% of my power used at off-peak rates at my house.
At 32 amps I think you’ll find you don’t need anything beefier. I had a 16A level 2 installed when I got my Volt many years ago, and I recently got a Bolt. I figured I would give the 16A a chance for a while and just see how it went. I no longer have any plans to upgrade because I plug the car in when I get home and it’s done charging long before I leave again in nearly every case.
Yeah, 32 amps should be good. Honestly with both of the PHEV’s I didn’t even need level 2. A dedicated receptacle would have been sufficient to charge them overnight. I do like being able to charge faster though, and since my cheap rates end at 11am and don’t occur on the weekend, it allows some more use on electric if we do an early errand or a bunch of running around on the weekend.
I am on the precipice of a major kitchen remodel. One requirement is a new panel directly below it in the garage. Once that is in, Parsko gets himself a welder. A short leap from that is a charge port for a car I don’t yet have.
So what are the 5 remaining mid-size sedan nameplates? Ya’d think you would tell us…
And what are the 20 that were available in 2010? I want to wax nostalgic about cars I never considered buying!!
Tesla, Lucid, BMW, VW, Audi, Mercedes, Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Acura, Infiniti… all have mid-size sedans? Is “nameplate” manufacturers or models? I just named 11, I call BS on the 5…
Camry, Accord, Altima, Sonata, K5?
The luxury ones don’t get counted the same even though they’re the same size, which makes no sense to me.
No mention of specifics, so one is too assume it means ALL mid-size, so my thinking includes luxury.
The Lucid is not midsize. They are pretty big. Maybe a bit larger than the Model S? (too lazy to look it up).
As others have said, luxury marks are not included in the “family mid-size” category due to the industry’s need to over-categorize things so every mfg can state they “best in class” this or that.
Words used, U.S. sales of every midsize sedan & total midsize sedan sales. So it’s just shoddy cut paste reporting without putting any thought into clarifying what it includes.
Volvo S60, Benz C class, BMW 3/5 series, Audi A4/A6, Jetta, Accord, Altima, Camry, K5, Sonata.
That’s like a dozen.
You’re own replay makes more sense than mine lol, but I am also wondering what 5 they consider midsize?
I assume they are Camry, Accord, Sonata, K5, and Altima as the last remaining ICE sedans.
Then if the rumors are true, then the Sonata and Altima will get the ax in a couple of years (no word on the K5), leaving only Camry and Accord. Then again, there’s also the possibility sedans come back due to declining birthrates and GenZ/Gen Alpha young adults totally rejecting the crossovers they were shuttled around in similar to how Millennials rejected minivans.
To many assumptions when it’s pointless to even include talk about the topic without clarification & more details. It also didn’t say ICE only, so who knows.
My family’s thick with licensed electricians, so we have a bunch of 15-amp outlets and a dedicated 30-amp outlet in the garage area.
My charging situation sucks. No EV to charge, but my Street has unreal power surges and “hard zaps” when the power goes off/on rapidly. Power Co says it’s the homebuilders fault, Homebuilder claims to have evidence to refute this for last 20 years, but is not showing it…
So I use my borrowed from neighbor battery charger to keep my riding mower charged. But my outlets are dead in the garage. So actually considering a Solar panel to charge the battery. Can anyone rec. a decent, portable affordable brand to check out? Thanks.
When life gets a bit more better and stable for me a Hybrid will be my first EV type purchase.
You may want to look to the RV industry for a voltage booster and surge protector for your sensitive circuits. Hughes and Progressive Industries seem to be brands people trust. Hughes makes a model where you can cheaply replace the blown surge circuity.
Appreciate the suggestions more than I can say. Big Thanks…
You should check out whole house surge protectors. They install in the electrical panel and protect the whole house from power surges. That should help you a lot.
Thank you.
I have two Tesla wall connectors load sharing a 60amp circuit. The setup works perfectly for our Model 3 and Y. It was installed in a way that a third can be easily added. Which will happen once any of our frequent visitors gets an EV.
Do you live in a rural area? I just would see a need for another charger for guests. We don’t fuel their ICE cars. In a pinch they couldn’t just use one of your existing. Are your current ones in your garage and you would add a third on the outside?
Rural? No, but DC fast charging between our house any where any of our out of state friends live is sparse to non-existent. Outside the major interstates, the middle of the country has awful DC fast charging options.
ICE visitors can just hit the gas station down the street when they stay overnight. If any of them switch to EVs, it would be a nice courtesy to charge them enough that they can get home without making a charging stop.
We just picked up a PHEV Volvo so I had two NEMA 14-50 outlets installed. I don’t NEED them as I can charge the T8 overnight on 110 but I figured I would get ahead of the game and be ready for the next step to a BEV. Ordering a Chargepoint home flex this weekend. Getting it with the J1772 (what my Volvo uses) but I like that I can swap cables later to NACS (for $200, at current prices)
Don’t have a 240v outlet in the garage, but one could be added easily if I ever acquire a PHEV or BEV. The panel is in the garage as well and has plenty of space.
Though my ~110 mile round trip daily commute that’s 90% highway at speeds > 70mph in a place that drops below freezing for a few weeks each winter and goes above 100 degrees for a couple weeks in the summer is just about the worst case for battery-driven vehicles. I suspect there would be times that I’d get less than half the EPA range on many EVs sold today. I would be very interested in V2H setups so long as it was fully in my control. I think that’s one of the killer use cases for a PHEV.
So glad to hear people like Farley say it’s time to ditch the “transitional technology” label. He’s right and I suspect Barra will change her tune once GM is able to roll out PHEVs and Hybrids in larger numbers.
I have a 40 amp level 2 at home, hard wired.
The Quebec government has a $600 grant when you buy you first electric vehicle (used applies as well) to offset the installation cost.
The building code now requires the rough in wiring with a minimum 40A capacity brought near the “regular parking spot for a vehicle” on the property for all new construction.
As for the GM vs Ford positions on hybrids: my read is that GM is further along with their BEV development than Ford and won’t “need” hybrids to satisfy the market demand as they’ll be rolling out a full BEV lineup instead.
I think Ford simply has a more diverse lineup of drivetrains right now. While both Ford and GM have EV’s on the market, Ford has been making both hybrids and PHEV’s for awhile now. GM makes ICE-only and EV-only drivetrains and nothing in between.
If Ford could produce vehicles without over 9000 recalls, GM would probably be very worried.
I charge on a regular 110 household outlet, though I’m probably going to have a NEMA outlet installed soon. I have no real interest in V2H setups, so that should be as far as I need to go.
SMART Alabama: Hahahahaha!
Bite me. We are a good, God fearing, Trump loving state here. Now just STFU, or we will come find you…
What are these “child labor laws” that you speak of?
Should we find somebody to read them to us? /s
My charging situation is all set. Dedicated 50 amp circuit with the charger positioned so I can charge inside or outside of the garage. The next upgrade won’t come until V2H and integration with my solar setup becomes reasonably affordable.
I have a level 2 charger plugged into a 50 amp NEMA.
From a sales standpoint, Ford is correct and that hybrids should be the current focus. From an R&D standpoint, GM is correct and we should be pushing towards a BEV future.
However the two are not mutually exclusive. Using the technology gained from developing better EVs should proliferate into outstanding HEV and PHEV offerings for the other segments that BEV doesn’t make sense yet.
Toyota and to a lesser extent Hyundai and Honda are doing this approach
I’ve just got a 110v outlet I use for my electric motorcycle. Unfortunately, the onboard charger took a dump and costs $800 to replace! I bought an offboard charger for $800 that is slower but will hopefully have better longevity.