On a long enough timeline, many of your heroes will become villains, and vice versa. The second-gen Toyota Prius comes to mind. As does the original Porsche Cayenne, which was Porsche’s attempt to save itself by building vehicles that would appeal to a wider base of consumers than its sports cars. At the time, Porsche’s only fans were sports car people, so many of them rejected the idea of a VW-based, Porsche-badged SUV.
The existence of the Cayenne helped, more than probably anything, secure the future of Porsche as a brand, and therefore is responsible in no small part for the continued existence of all those two-door 911s and Boxsters we all love. We owe the 955/957 Cayenne respect if only for that reason.
Here’s a better reason: They rule. Aesthetically, the original Cayenne just works. The brightwork on the DLO (daylight opening) and the rockers is iconic. The massive, oxygen-sucking vents give the Cayenne an attitude missing from many of the anonymous SUVs of the present. This is also the best use case of Porsche’s weird turn towards broken-omelet headlights.
They could also handle quite well for a big, tall thing, weighing in at under 5,000 pounds dry with a not-terrible 55/45 weight distribution front/rear. Today, enthusiasts are starting to notice that these are alluringly inexpensive to buy. Is there a reason for that? I drive a BMW with almost 240,000 miles on the odometer, so my tolerance for dysfunction is a little higher than average. Plus, if something goes wrong I can just blog the misery.
What about civilians? Is it dangerous to suggest such a car to them?
I mention this because, as Thomas recently pointed out, these Cayennes are not without some quirks:
As you can probably expect, depreciated luxury SUVs in general aren’t the most reliable things on the road, so let’s address the big elephant in the room first: bore scoring, an issue known to affect 4.5-liter and 4.8-liter V8 Cayenne models. The only way to fix it is to rebuild the entire engine, but it’s easy to check for and prevent. A pre-purchase inspection with a borescope can determine whether or not a Cayenne has bore scoring. So long as you change the oil every 5,000 miles, use a good filter, don’t over-do short drives where the engine oil can’t warm up, and keep an eye on your fuel trims to ensure the engine isn’t over-fuelling due to clogged or bad injectors, an engine that hasn’t already started to suffer bore scoring will almost certainly last the life of the vehicle.
A more prevalent issue on V8 models made before January 2007 is coolant leaking from crossover pipes in the valley of the engine. See, Porsche made these pipes out of plastic, and now that early models are more than 20 years old, that plastic can sometimes crack. Replacing these pipes is labor-intensive but definitely DIY-able.
So, yeah, not perfect. Especially the V8s.
Meet My Buddy Ron, Who Has $15,000 To Buy Something
Ron isn’t his name. I’m withholding his name to protect him from whatever bad decisions I convince him to make. Ron is awesome. He’s a lawyer who likes the same kind of indie rock I do and, other than being a big Bills fan, he seems to make wise decisions. We met because we both play ultimate frisbee and, being around the same age, hit it off almost immediately. Not long ago he asked me if he should buy a Model Y at a price close to its historical bottom and listened to me when I told him he probably couldn’t find as much EV for so little dough.
He loves his Model Y but wants another car. His Honda CR-V lease is up soon and he’s got about $15,000 to spend, in total. He asked me if he should just buy a used RAV4 Hybrid or similar and I said that would be logical. Not fun. But logical. Ron wants something to work as a secondary car that can absorb a few ski trips and eventually be handed down to the kids.
After talking about older Kias and Toyotas I suggested some other things. In particular, I suggested he bid on this clean 2008 Porsche Cayenne S. I suggested no more than $7,500 for a top-end price. After some heated bidding, the Cayenne went for more than that, so he didn’t end up with this one.
The idea was still rolling around in his head and we turned to Craigslist. There are a lot of 2003-2010 Cayennes on Craigslist if you’re willing to look. I found one Cayenne S in Rye, New York for just $5,000 and only 170,000 miles on it. Because I would like Ron to remain my friend, I did suggest that he get any car we’re looking at inspected. The small amount of money is worth the peace of mind, especially with the risk of bore scoring.
Here’s the response of his mechanic at a shop I sometimes also use and generally like:
I disagree. Well, I disagree on the “no matter what you’re paying” part. The “masochists” part is likely true. Did I mention Ron is a Bills fan?
Please Give Ron Better Advice Than I Can
Here’s my theory on all of this. Ron has a completely reliable car. He has $15,000. If he spends under $7,500 on a Cayenne he has a margin of $7,500 to do all sorts of important things to make a real runner of a car that’s going to be more fun to own and more fun to drive than any $15,000 RAV4 or equivalent.
All that being said, Thomas has made some good points about these cars. He thinks a Turbo or a VR6-powered model is unlikely to be a bore score victim and, therefore, probably a better starting point than an NA V8-powered car. Thomas suggested this one in a fetching green:
It’s just $6,000, leaving a lot of room for improvements (slight lift, bigger wheels, unnecessary foglights). As Thomas put it “a coil sprung 3.6 model is Cayenne life on easy mode.”
So, what do you think? Am I correct in that, with enough due diligence, any V8 is fine? Or, do you agree with Thomas, that V6er without the complicated suspension is the way to go? Or, maybe, should Ron just go with the RAV4?
Top Photo: Cars & Bids
That Michael Vick/Ron Mexico joke really takes me back. What a weird tale that was.
“This Sebring 2.7 is a convertible! YOLO!”
“This Aerostar seats 7! YOLO!”
“This first gen Cayenne…”
Probably don’t go by me because I’m weird, but I think a “YOLO” purchase would be something fun and unusual that might be a problem, not some ugly old SUV that will likely be a problem in a market absolutely saturated with SUVs, many of which will be cheaper to run and just as boring.
Well I just sold my ’08 S last spring with 143K on it, bought it with 119K. Mostly pretty reliable but had some minor weird and one super annoying issue.
First up it randomly wouldn’t start and to compound this the steering column would be locked-after it happened twice figured a work around where I disconnected the battery neutral (under driver’s seat carpet) it would then reset it and would start-several trips to two reputable indie Porsche mechanics couldn’t fix the problem.
Less annoying issue because I caught it the drains plugged and it sounded like I was driving around a giant fish bowl, if I’d had a place to work on it not terrible to fix-was $500 at the indie mechanic.
Passenger side headlight had a weird moisture issue I could never figure out how to fix, but eventually collected enough at the base to corrode the controller contacts and keep the low beams from working. Replaced it with a clean used one-which developed the same problem right before I sold it.
Have your friend get a OBDII checker for Porsche I’ve never had a car with so many CELs that didnt’ actually need addressing. Got one for the variable valve timing that never came back. Had an ongoing code thrown every 3-6 months for the thermostat being out of spec but it never manifested as an overheating problem and since the mechanic quoted me $1500 to replace it since it’s buried under the intake manifold I figured I’d keep letting it go.
Rear wiper occasionally got stuck and the rear washer never worked.
Rear view camera crapped out and was so bad that it wasn’t worth the insane cost to fix it.
Rear power hatch motor was pretty weak by time I sold it but wasn’t great even when I bought it.
Not a problem per se-but oil changes are really expensive, you’d be a fool not to run high dollar synthetic and it has something like a 10 quart sump in the v8-but also I assume your buddy is buying a v8 because otherwise what’s the point?
Occasionally blew some smoke on startup never could figure out if this was an actual sign of a problem or just a quirk of a high compression v8…
Driver’s door sagged slightly-unless it had been in an undisclosed accident and poorly fixed.
Not a problem but sort of annoying, unless you’re flooring it the cayenne is programmed to start in 2nd gear. This is great if you’re trying to drive around gently but is annoying when you start to roll out realizing you’re not going quite fast enough and it kicks down to 1st thereby breaking your passenger’s neck. You can drive in sport to get around this but the programming imo is too sporty for daily driving. Sometimes moderate fast acceleration in 1st is what you want and the cayenne literally isn’t programmed for it. 2-3 shift was also a bit rough when cold.
OTOH air suspension never had a problem, in spite of having a worn driveshaft support bearing that was worn when I bought it (a known weak point) it never failed or became a problem. Control arms were supposedly coming up on needing replaced when I sold it per the mechanic but I couldn’t tell any difference from when I’d bought it-try that in a BMW. Best seats of any car I’ve owned. Didn’t leak oil or any other fluids-in stark contrast to the 3 BMWs and 1 Audi I’ve owned which all seemingly leaked from every gasket they had. It was fantastic in the snow, and shockingly fun to drive when pushed even on AT tires, a truly weird swiss army knife car that slowly grew on me. I might have kept it if I hadn’t been spooked by the weird no-start gremlin not being readily fixable. My basic take is they’re largely fairly reliable especially considering what you’re getting-BUT parts and labor really are quite expensive and there are many little things that are fairly cheap on lesser cars that will be very spendy or hard to DIY on the Porsche because it was engineered by a company that normally makes rear engined cars that are 100% focused on performance before any kind of servicability concerns.
People have claimed 20+gallons of water fit in the plenum when the drains clog.
The driver door sag is very common. Not sure what causes it but people usually just shim the lower hinge.
I wonder if your no-start was the common immobilizer issue. It is pretty common to have to solder some new MOSFETs into the board. Usually this just causes battery drain, though.
The Touareg also has the famous weird VAG 1st gear programming. On mine it does shift to first if you stop for more than like 2 seconds. This is really annoying because it means you have to come to a stop and then push the brake pedal down further so it doesn’t start creeping when it downshifts.
The air suspension is claimed to be one of the most reliable air suspensions put on a production vehicle. This isn’t saying much.
I always wondered if the no-start was related to the immobilizer since the car would partially turn on when it happened. My mechanic read the computer and didn’t find any clues-there is some wiring that runs through the drivers side floor that commonly is a problem they re-wired it and the problem didnt’ come back for awhile so I sold it while I could have somewhat of a clean conscience only to hear from the guy I sold it to like a week later asking me what the work around was because it failed to start on him smh.
The Cayenne must be different on the transmission then (unless if you have the v6 maybe it’s different?) bc mine always started in 2nd unless it was in sport mode or you were basically flooring it, or if you were using any of the 4wd Off road modes it would start in 1st.
And agreed re: the suspsension-supposedly it’s not killer to DIY, but the mechanic quoted me around $2k per corner to replace leaking airbags if it happened.
Does Ron have Porsche Deferred Maintenance money on top of his $15,000?
No?
He’s better off leasing a Mazda.
When I bought mine for cheap off a family member, since I wasn’t making a car payment I opened a 2nd checking acct with my bank to siphon off a few hundred a month to be my somewhat guilt free Porsche maintenance fund-and it reliably got spent down 😀
Do it. That’s how you get good content.
At something that is pushing 20 years old, I would avoid one from the salt (rust) belt states. That would avoid the major corrosion issues.
After owning a 1st gen 2006, bought with 200000ks in Australia(bought for $9000A, spent $3000 on servicing and upkeep inc tyres and exhaust,love the new exhaust note), for a year now it’s an absolute pleasure to drive, more than enough power, large cargo area, air suspension is worth every cent especially when driving windy roads on low to cruising the bush as I lift the suspension and drink my coffee cruising through the 4wd tracks with ease, and remember it’s just a vw toureg underneath with Porsche running gear, suspension and interior(is better in the Porsche) not that expensive on upkeep compared to any 4wd try a Lexus 570 that’s more expensive and less fun
Just tell your friend that it is horribly flawed in a huge way: it’s missing the Jatco Xtronic CVT, the best in transmission technology! Don’t let him go w”Ron”g with a CVT-less vehicle.
That made me laugh so hard I snorted chili. Take your smiley face!
Someday you must come clean and tell us about the horror Nissan that did this to you.
Well, you can get that gen Cayenne with a manual and it avoids the maintenance horrors of the VW V10 TDI.
So yes Cayenne, but maybe not this one?
Call me a heretic, but I think a BMW X5 is a better car to own and drive – and much better looking. Every Cayenne I have driven felt slightly cramped and seemed sort of dull unless you were really running at high speeds.
Above 80, brilliant for an SUV. For most driving, an X5 is better in almost every way.
Pretty different use cases IMO. X5 is for people who need a car but want an SUV. Cayenne is for people who need an SUV but want a car.
There is an OG Cayenne Turbo in that same color on a nearby street to me in PHL. Just street parked outside of a massive mansion. I guess they don’t have room in the drive for a car from 2 decades ago. Every time I walk by it I’m like, do want.
YOLOOOOOO. DO IT DO IT DO IT DO IT!
Porsche Cayenne is always and will forever be the real answer.
Like you said, he’s got other cars if things happen. The VR6 in these is a little slow, though, so maybe just work with the V8’s known issues?
Besides, the first-gen has the most off-road goods and you can get them with a tow hitch. I still need a Cayenne (albeit I want a second-gen unless a Transsyberia drops in my lap) to tow my parsh with a parsh.
You’ve done the right thing in getting it inspected. Mind the list of “repair this now” you get back from said mechanic and stay on top of maintenance and Porsches are generally pretty reliable.
This is good parsh! You’d be crazy not to.
Signed,
Car Masochist Who Says DO IT
P.S.: The top image gives it away, man. You know this in your heart to be true. DO IT!
PARSH??!!??!!!?!!
heck yeah, y’all’re talkin’ ’bout that gott danged good parsh
I knew you would appear… 😀
Do it, as long as you are prepared to do a lot of DIY catching up on maintenance and no less than $6k on things you can’t do yourself. Financially it makes no sense, but if you have time and extra money, sure.
Nah… don’t do it. The oil industry has long supported Trump and the Republicans. And that Porsche will use a lot of oil-related products in terms of fuel and other fluids.
On top of that, the tariff games Trump is playing are very likely to cause a recession in the USA. So in light of that, get a vehicle with low operating costs.
Get a Prius Prime/Plug-in… like this green one with 100,000 miles that you can get for just $11,500:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicle/723974548
It’s a nice fuel efficient, durable car with low operating costs and should also be cheaper to insure.
Just the PPI and specifically have it checked for the headgasket issue that some of these have had.
But having said that, even if it happens, it’s something many have fixed themselves:
https://priuschat.com/threads/3rd-gen-prius-head-gasket-replacement-guide-draft.247102/
To put it in terms a Bills fan will understand, imagine buying a $15,000 picnic table and then putting $15,000 in cash on top of it, lighting the cash on fire, and then jumping through the table.
This might be perfectly acceptable and hilarious, or you might end up on fire with ($30,000) to show for it. Your call!
My boss had one of these for about 2 years and sold it to his mechanic at 75% off. Beyond repair. This is a guy who rebuilds/mods Skylines as a hobby.
I can’t believe I’m saying this, but, so long as he can afford the repairs (or is an above average DIY-ist) these aren’t too terrible. I regularly see them with that kind of mileage and all things considered, they’re not catastrophically broken. Plus, I’ve only seen two in all my years service advising that were diagnosed with bore scoring, and I’ve seen A LOT of Cayennes. These are also pretty popular to turn into overlanding rigs. So, as German SUVs go, you could definitely make worse choices.
Certainly the 2007 and older NA v8’s are the more notorious bore scorers. strangely the Turbo Variants are considered less prone due to better cooling, but I don’t know that this passes my sniff test.
the 957 V8’s were less prone to scoring, but were Direct injection, so that always concerns me with regard to Carbon build up on valves. and the Variocam system is a bit more complicated to keep the engine in time.
if you kind of want an SUV and cheap, but also reliable, though not likely as fun to the ears, the 2005-2012 Rav 4 with the 3.5 V6 is reported to be nearly as quick to 60 as most of these Cayenne’s at 6.3 seconds. The much later, but also much more expensive RAV4 Prime with electric motor torque ups the performance on that hybrid even more though.
Life.
Is.
Short.
Get the Porsche.
If it all goes pear shaped, he’ll have the memories.
Plus, he’s a lawyer. He needs to look a LITTLE baller for his clients. A nice ride is a sign of a winning record! And can’t he just sue somebody to finance his next questionable decision? That’s how law talking works, right?
I was going to say he should opt for a Durango RT or SRT, but I agree a Lawyer on this budget should probably just go VR6 and ball away. only other ballers will know any better.
The well-heeled clients will think “Ooh, Parsh!” while the more frugal or enthusiast clients will applaud the restraint of basically buying an old Touareg 🙂
PARSH PARSH PARSH PARSH
I think she’s trying to tell us something, but I can’t quite make it out.
BUY THE PARSH! BUY THE PARSH!
Keep in mind that the Touareg and Cayenne are built on the same platform and share many of the same parts. You are going to face the same repair costs so you might as well get the PARSH with better interior and better performance. PARSH all the way…
Of course, even my indie Porsche mechanic laughed out loud when I mentioned I was thinking of buying a 1st Gen Cayenne. Then he stopped laughing and very seriously said “NO”… he walked over to a quiet corner in the garage and curled into a tight, little ball of a man and began weeping quietly.
I think one key difference between them — and let me be clear, neither is a good idea — is that the VW was saddled with the excellent VR6, while the Parsh in question is a V8 model. Years of anecdotes tell me the motor is the biggest pain point.
The base Parsh had a pretty spicy tune of a VR6.
Where the hell is my lawyer? He was supposed to be here an hour ago!
I’ve said this before but this feels like the perfect opportunity to do some more armchair fabrication.
I really want to buy one of these in the Turbo form, cut off the body, and weld on vintage Wagoneer body instead. Then I will call it the Cayennero. They are close enough in measurements that I could make it work. I’ve checked.
Top of the line in utility sports,
Unexplained fires are a matter for the courts!
Canyonero! Canyonero! (Yah!)
She blinds everybody with her super high beams,
She’s a squirrel crushing, deer smacking, driving machine!
Canyonero!-oh woah, Canyonero! (Yah!)
I assume this project will be fully endorsed by a clown.
I’m nearly done with another floorpan and chassis swap of a Tahoe and ’71 Travelall, so you know, I could use another project soon…….(ok not really, I have like 5 other projects that need attention….)
In closing, yes do it. just get the turbo.
Love that you’ve actually checked the measurements for this cockamamie idea.
Hmm. I’m not so sure the first gen is the right choice, but I get that price-wise you might get a ratty 92a (958) versus an OK 955/957 and have money to burn on getting it up to snuff. My suggestion is to buy the best one you can find – one with thorough service history, no major accidents, low-ish (relative) miles and also check that the tires on the beast are proper, brand name tires. Nothing says “abused and neglected” on a German car like shitty chinese tires.
Tire comment applies to all vehicles really.
True, but especially high-dollar cars. If the previous owner skimped on items you can actually see, what about items you can’t?
Hey brand new LingLongs! Score!
What about Chinese tires in general? Apparently Sailun makes an excellent EV tire.
My uncle splurged and bought a W114 Mercedes 250 back in the late 60s. When it was time to replace the tires, he bought retreads. SMH
In the 70s, my dad drove around for miles to find the one gas station that was a penny cheaper than the others.
The Depression messed with thier heads.
I rode in a coil sprung base model Cayenne from London to Le Mans France and back, on the smoothest toll roads France had to offer I felt like I was going to piss pure blood as a young teenager, the ride was atrocious, and that car was a one owner with pretty low miles.
So no, I don’t recommend a coil sprung Cayenne.
easy as in least hard on the wallet, less so on the old spine of course.
R(NHRN)?
That might not be the best way to camouflage ‘Ron’: it looks like ‘Ron H Ron’. No wonder you didn’t use it. 🙂
I saw your comment and instantly read it as Ron Ron. And i’m ok with that.
GF had one of these, same 1st gen LCI trim and it was surprisingly reliable. Not needing anything more than wear items like brakes, oil and such.
The only downside is that Cayennes look like frogs and I’ve never been able to get past their looks. At least the LCI headlights are ever so slightly better looking.
“Eventually be handed down to the kids.”
Well, that’s one way to get them to move out of the house.
Blatant Parsch signaling!
I HAVE BEEN SUMMONED.
GOOD PARSH
GOOD PARSH!
GOOD PARSH!!!!!!!