When buying a car sight-unseen, in addition to the typical maintenance records and history report, there’s one big thing people check:Â How well is the car presented? The dingier the car looks online, the harder it is to find confidence in it, meaning that bad presentation can seriously affect value. Today we’re looking at a BMW legend, an E28 M5 that recently hammered on Bring A Trailer for the incredibly low sum of $17,200, partly because the seller didn’t seem to put massive effort into presentation.
Before the digital age, bringing a car to auction was difficult for the average owner. They’d have to physically bring a car to a location, pay for photography and cataloging, and likely pay an additional seller’s fee. Now though, any number of online auction websites make it something people can do from home.
However, there’s a reason listing a car for auction used to be expensive — presentation is absolutely everything when you don’t have the greatest opportunity to meet buyers face-to-face, and trying to take on the task of presentation yourself can lead to mixed results.
Unless you’re shooting interior pics, it’s generally not a great idea to photograph cars in shaded or backlit settings. While Gino Vannelli did sing that black cars look better in the shade, buyers of said black cars want clear photos that really show off the good, the bad, and the ugly. Notice how much of the front grille and valence are buried in shadow in this picture. It’s hard to make a reasonable judgement of condition if you aren’t able to see what’s going on particularly well.
Speaking of photographs, it helps if they’re all taken at the same time, because the listing for this M5 shows similar pictures with different depictions of damage. In one front end shot, the valence appears far more marked up than in the other, which raises questions. Was the paint recently touched-up, or did things get worse? How recent are any of the photos in the gallery? More importantly, what is the actual current state of the car?
In addition to pictures that seem to have been taken at different times, some of the cropping on this listing’s images feels strange. That photo above? I didn’t crop it in any way, this is just how it appears on the listing.
Another important aspect of getting a car ready for sale is making sure it looks its best. People like buying clean cars, and the leather surfaces in this M5 are looking pretty dirty. A few minutes with a leather cleaner would’ve made the cabin of this supersedan look far nicer, and that’s the sort of thing buyers are looking for when bidding on a car sight-unseen.
While we’re on the subject of using a little elbow grease, in this profile shot, the left front tire is visibly underinflated, which doesn’t paint the world’s most flattering image of maintenance. This is one of those things that’s ridiculously easy to remedy, but it just wasn’t rectified when this car was shot.
Here’s something missing from this M5 listing: Video. These days, it’s fairly standard for Bring A Trailer listings to have a driving video and/or a cold start video, but the listing for this M5 only had pictures. Sure, it should run and drive, but there’s no video proof that it does. When you’re bidding from, say, across the country, video proof is nice to have.
While it is remarkably easy to list a car on an online auction site, it takes effort to list it well. In addition to giving a car a good clean and a once-over, it helps to either brush up on photography lessons before taking any pictures, or farm that work out. Sure, hiring a pro for photos will cost you at least $500, but so long as the return is greater than the staging costs, that’s money well-spent.
In any case, well-done to the person who won this auction, as $17,200 is an exceptionally good price for an E28 M5. In fact, it’s the cheapest E28 M5 not explicitly described as a project to hammer on Bring A Trailer since 2018, and by a considerable margin. For the person not looking for something perfect, a little bit of effort could turn this into a presentable three-season daily driver, something that every M5 excels at.
(Photo credits: Bring A Trailer)
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Wow I missed this, typically these have been selling for $40K-$60K! And to think I paid $7K for my 1983 e28 533i-clearly the inferior car for another $10K I could’ve had the ultimate e28. Of course if this M5 was as lazily maintained as the auction preparation makes it appear someone’s going to need all those savings to catch up with deferred maintenance.
I’ve sold three cars on C&B. Two I took my own photos and video, one I paid for a pro to do the photos. The two I did myself were still way better quality than the auctions featured here, and the cars were properly cleaned/prepped.
Results, the two I did sold for about what I expected. I was hoping for more on both, but realistically, they probably sold for about the right number for both me and the buyer.
The one that I had a pro do the photos sold for significantly more than I expected. About 40% more. Some of that was likely timing, as I sold during the height of Covid car shortages, but still was surprised at the hammer price.
I’m baffled from this because I thought BaT had a higher bar than this in their auctions.
Staging and good photos make a world of difference. I once bought a ’73 Yamaha RD350 off of eBay, sight unseen. It was in the early aught’s and it was one of those ‘e-mail for photos’ listings. I did, and got some photos that were taken with a film camera in a dark garage. The tank looked great, from what I could see of it, and the opening bid was $500. I wanted a project, and it was reasonable. Turned out, I was the only bidder. It was gorgeous. Sat indoors for 30 years and needed some things, but fantastic. Score! It was stolen from a garage in Chicago before I could ride it, but still…
Whenever I sell a running car in person, I pay for a “pre-purchase” inspection of it to show the mechanical condition. That has resulted in selling it to the first or second person who comes to see it…
If I was to sell one over the internet I would make sure to photograph the underside during said inspection showing that it’s not a rust bucket. I would also photograph the wheel arches and engine bay. And lastly, I would pay for the paint-less dent removal experts to straighten any dings if it is a collectors car…
I can guess what happened here. There was probably a lot of back and forth between the auction specialist and the seller, the seller refused to submit decent photos, everyone got frustrated, and the show-runners at BaT just said Eff it, let it run. It’s No Reserve, so it’s the seller who’s going to take the hit.
Sorry but have to disagree here. For every buyer who follows these rules there is a questionable seller using these rules to scam people. A dealer always cleans and details cars does minimum fixes to get it sellable then rushes ever aspect of the sell but the F&I. Any hard and fast rules go both ways. Nothing beats research on the vehicle. I have bought 2 vehicles on auction site unseen. I did okay because I bought 2 unrunning projects to combine into one driving car. Paid $1,500 combined and that resulted in buying nothing else but wearable parts tires, belts, hoses etc.
Frankly I would love to see a story here about whether buying 2 similar vehicles for one project is better than buying one vehicle and sourcing the many parts.
I agree. The seller clearly isn’t trying to hide anything here, which makes me trust them more.
You didn’t import the picture of the dash gauges with tach. at 0. That is an idiotic seller move. Tells it doesn’t run, or lights up like a Christmas tree.
Sorry, but you’re wrong. It’s a side shot. The two photos at the beginning of the article are both three-quarter front shots. As someone who started dabbling in photography in high school, burned through hundreds of rolls of film shooting motorcycle races, and did a stint between jobs photographing cars for the Auto Trader (back when you either took pics and mailed them in, dropped them off, or had someone come out to shoot them) I couldn’t let that slide.
https://visualeducation.com/class/professional-car-photography-3-4-front-view/
Thats what I thought but since before cellphones my last camera was a Kodak 126 pocket instamatic I felt less than qualified.
Sight unseen.
At that price?
Wouldn’t that be nice!
Unfortunately I over think everything.
No thank you.
Spin on!
E28 is peak 5 series. Fite me.
I’d say E23 or E32 7 series is straight up peak BMW.
And you would be correct. That’s why I qualified my statement with “5 series” 🙂
As a matter of fact, the E32 may be the most perfect large sedan design, together with MB W116 and W126. I know it’s not an original thought, but I’m having a hard time imagining better designs before or since, especially because their lives ended around the time the Explorer and Cherokee were taking over everything.
Good point and full agreement with what you said.
Nope, peak BMW was the 2002 tii, as it was great performance sedan for it’s time. Unfortunately every model after it is worse. The same is true for Audi, as every Quattro after my 1984 4000q is worse as well…
My favorite pre A- Audi that I’ve owed was an 85CGT Comm Ed. I switched to late-90s-2000s BMW and like them all better.
There is no peak Audi, only trough Audi.
You apparently do not know about the 4000q as they will run for hundreds of thousands of miles with only basic service….
That’s a bit silly. E30 m3 to name just one
If you don’t mind the cost of keeping them on the road….
They’re very reliable cars, and pretty simple mechanically. And the climbing values means it’s worth the upkeep.
Needs some Euro bumpers though. Yikes 0_o
No problem me and the e would ku k your but while you look for your snubbed g and h buddies. LOL
Say what now?
Just having some spelling fun
Ok, how’s this: Peak BMW was the E34. Last model with the narrow kidney grill, and the M5 Touring was the last of the M’s to be hand built by M-Sport. (Mic drop)
I’ll allow it… In second place.
It could be a good deal, but for all we know, the engine could lack compression. The transmission could have shift problems. Maybe the radiator is clogged. The shocks might be worn out. There are a lot of expensive potential defects here.
As you stated in your own article, we don’t have enough presentation to prove one way or the other. So it’s not proper to call it “an exceptionally good price” yet.
What keeps most from online auctions is that a lot of the time, cars aren’t presented well because presenting them well will reveal the severe defects the owner doesn’t want you to find before buying it. This is a highly optimistic price for a remote purchase of a well-worn car. That’s nowhere near a low price for something so unproven.
The first online car auction site that establishes a mandatory set of comprehensive presentation photos and videos will be the first one I trust. As it is, each seller determines how much I should trust them by what they present and how they do it. But there’s big opportunity for site owners here that they’re all overlooking.
Agreed which is a bid unrunning project only peices.
Isn’t that kind of high for an E28 M5
down payment? It doesn’t seem like that low of a price for one of those cars however rare.I thought they went for 10k or so in drivable condition, but I admit that was awhile ago.
The reason cars like that don’t sell for that much is because they usually require a lot of work that can be quite expensive.
Exactly…
I had a shot at one of these once for $3k. Sure, it had almost 300,000 kms on it. Sure, the engine was in a box beside the car. How hard could it be to build a German motor that was one step removed from a racing motor? When you’re a broke student? For some unfathomable reason, my dad wouldn’t lend me the money.
And if the same deal came up today, I’d be all over it like a fat kid on Smartie.
Well, on the flip side, the buyer may have just spent $17k on a clapped out M5 that didn’t have a cold start video for a reason. Seller said it sat for “a few years” and the pictures that are on there don’t paint a great picture of a M5 with a quarter million miles on it.
And does anyone else find the people who just spend all day in the BaT comment s a bit weird? Trashing sellers, picking apart cars they may or may not have any intention to bid on. Or the flip side, the comments that encourage higher bidding like they have a stake in it selling high.
I feel like a substantial portion of the comments are trying to manipulate the price of the car in one way or another, which is a bit of a shame because sometimes there’s actually useful information in them.
There’s a reason why live auctions don’t permit chatter during bidding. And it’s the same reason why I don’t normally consider BaT for any of my purchases or sales. It’s not hard to manipulate prices.
Everyone should be required to stop once the bidding starts, unless calling out fraud or malfeasance to the auctioneer, or whispering to a partner next to you. I’ve seen people asked to leave local auctions for talking while bidding is taking place.
Remember the auction site benefits from fraud as they take a percentage of the sale price. So the only thing would be bidders can’t comment to crowd and auctioneers can’t inflate the price either.
While I hear you, I cant help but warn anyone bidding on an R50 Mini Cooper CVT that the transmission is held together with Legos, chewing gum, and gravity. I’m doing the Lord’s work, and I’ll die on this hill. I have a hard time watching bidders go nuts on a car with a well known manufacturing flaw that will total the car. The seller has to know, and the buyer is most likely clueless. Some cars shouldn’t ever be bought.. Maybe that should be a story for Autopean: What cars should you *always* walk away from?
Good question! That would make an excellent article.
For me, anything from GM, other than relabeled Japanese cars. (This comes from my personal experience, such as it is, and having worked in auto parts for a while – the parts guys know what kind of cars to avoid!)
Dang, friends of mine recently asked what car they should buy when theirs took a crap on Tuesday. While I’ve got no shortage of opinion, I hate making other people assume my risk. They found a 2014 3.6L V6 Equinox w/ 88k miles for $9k, which was about 40k fewer miles from anything I found. Their criteria was AWD and room for 4.. I immediately looked for Highlander, GX470, and 4Runner.. Most examples were 130-150k miles for the same money, but surely have better chances at seeing 200k than an Equinox. I did find a couple others (2012 Veracruz, 2006 Santa Fe), there was a period when Hyundai was an unbeatable choice for value/reliability.. I want to keep my fool mouth shut, the deadline is Sunday. Whats the right move? Do friends let friends buy a GM??
In the spirit of your Mini comment above, the earlier 3.6 V6 had a lot of timing chain failures. Not sure if they were sorted by 2014 or not. In the Traverse it required dropping the front subframe with the engine and transmission to change it. Search for sub-$2K Traverses/Acadias /Enclaves on FB Marketplace.
For the same money I’d take 40K more miles on a Highlander all day long.
Just the facts ma’am. GM doesn’t suck but remind them you haven’t seen it or driven it so your opinion is not guaranteed.
The Equinox is probably a better car than everything you mentioned except for the Four Runner. Though one issue is that domestic cars are more likely to be neglected…
However, given Toyota’s never ending rust issues make the Four Runner a dodgy bet at best. As I have seen dangerous examples here in Portland, OR where we still have old Ford Fairmounts and Mavericks as well as air cooled VW still on the road…
To give Toyota credit, they have improved their rust issues since my late stepfather owned a Corona that rusted out in a year and a half. I know Michigan salt was bad, but a lifespan of a year and a half?!?!?! And that was rusted to the point that its tires were making contact with the wheel wells due to suspension points moving and water was coming into the car every time it went thru a puddle…
I don’t think GM is universally junk by any means. I think 70%+ of all GM products ever are hot garbage, but that also applies to Ford and Chrysler, and a number of other manufacturers.
I don’t know anything about Kia/Hyundai, except that their cars had a reputation in the 90s for being worse than a Yugo and that their cars in the 2010s can’t keep piston rings intact, which they’re still fixing under warranty IF the engine is consuming oil at an unacceptable rate. The unacceptable rate being more than one quart every 1000 miles, or five quarts between changes for those of you counting. I can’t imagine a lot of good things happened in the interim, and I don’t think a lot of good things have happened since.
Agreed on the domestic cars, and Hyundai had a sweet spot for a few years. 90s Hyundais were spotty, but 2000-2010 was a good decade. Their 2.0L I4 engine was bulletproof (found in most of their lineup), and I personally owned 3 which I bought new and put 180k miles on without issues. My Tiburon, Elantra, Tucson all had their original clutch when I sold and the following 2012 Verarcruz (3.8L V6) was just as problem free. Their subsequent engines were all a hot mess.
I decided to keep my mouth shut and let them buy the Equinox, though I recommended checking oil once a month and doing changes at 3k religiously, as that seems to fix much of the issues (timing chain tensioner gets dry, oil burning, etc..). My friends have to leave the US in 2 years when their visa runs out, and I’m sure it can last 12 months.. right?!
And keeps better cars from the auction. Think about it. The best trade ins are kept by the dealer for their used lot. Then 2nd level most local used dealers have agreement with new car dealers to buy trade ins. Then and only then do you get to auctions. And now uneducated civilians are bidding against experienced dealers so either they outbid the dealers on a good car or get stuck with something no dealer wants.
Are dealers really buying on Bring a Trailer or did you mean auctions in general? Dealers aren’t buying at public auctions unless its a rare car, from what I’ve seen.
Sorry I meant dealers are buying at general auctions not bat
Any rebadged Japanese cars from GM are the ones I would avoid.
GM’s FWD Buick Century was the best FWD car with an Automatic Transmission that was sold in the US when it was available. As a wrench I have seen those things continue to run on neglect and abuse…
Just as the Crown Vic was the best RWD car with an Automatic that was sold in the US when it was available. Likewise, as Cab Drivers & LEO’s have a hard time killing them…
Granted I just don’t buy cars with an automatic transmission, never have, never will. But I don’t know of a tougher “performance car” than my 2007 Mustang GT with a manual trans, except for better years for the live axle Mustang GT or the better versions of the Chevy Camaro, particularly if you want an automatic…
As for EV’s, the Chevy Bolt is the best commuter EV, thought their battery supplier sucked…
My experience with most Japanese cars is that they suck donkey dicks. Garbage like Honda’s crappy CVT & pressed on rotors are typical examples of disposable cars from Japan. Granted that some years of Toyota’s pickup and Four Runner are good, unless they have a frame made out of substandard metal and scale…
Not sure how you have had experience with only the single worst Japanese car in the world. Every single Toyota and Honda made before the millennium is famous for a reason, they’re really good for the most part. I’ve had great experience with my 1992 accord.
“Every single Toyota and Honda made before the millennium is famous for a reason”
So you don’t know about Toyota’s LE Van or the Hondamatic Transmission. Yes they were famous for being horrible cars…
You’re right, every single was an exaggeration. That being said, Hondamatics aren’t really known for anything, considering rather few people, even old Honda enthusiasts, even know what that is.
Well I mostly agree with you but Legos are hard core long lasting ask my bare feet how I know?
.. But they fall apart unless you use the Kragle.
Even on my 10yo Taco with over 300K miles that I listed on Craig’s prestigious list I still washed the hell out of it and took it to the park on a sunny day to take the photos. I may have gone over the top on the description though “…in two-thousand and three this Tacoma was hand crafted by Toyota’s finest artisans…”
Unf. Do want. My mom’s neighbour has the same car sitting in the yard. Unmoved in at least fifteen years. Sigh
It never hurts to leave a note or ask, sometimes you never know when a seller just never got around to selling it.
I definitely intend to when I’ve got the cash
Don’t get me started. I was living in Eureka, the true Northern California, and ran into this elder Doctor who while we were talking about my Amigo mentioned his MGTD project he had in the barn. I mentioned I always wanted one of those. He showed me a clean frame, unattached body parts and boxes of well labeled parts. He said he bought it decades ago to do a project with his son who had no interest in it. He asked if I was interested. I said yes depends on the price. He said he paid $500 so he just wanted his money back. I told him it 2as worth probably worth more but said yes and promised him payment at 9am Monday morning after the banks opened. Unfortunately he told his son and by Monday he apologized and said he sold it for $17,000. He did offer me it for that but I couldn’t afford it. I congrats him got a thank you card from him. Think how long that car would have been sitting there, at least someone else might have got it going.
I had a Bedford J1 truck with a camper conversion on my front lawn I had been meaning to sell for years once I realised I was never going to do anything with it, and a Holden Rodeo tray in the driveway that I had inherited from my father-in-law that I had no further use for.
A guy round the corner knew the Bedford was there and knew his mate wanted one, so brought him round one weekend to look and he offered me more $ on the spot for it than I had been planning to advertise it for. The neighbour who had brought him round asked if I wanted to sell my 1962 Valiant, and I told him no, but I was looking to get rid of the Rodeo, and he gave me a decent cash offer on the spot so he could use it as a work vehicle.
If they hadn’t taken a chance on knocking on the door and asking, I’d still have two lawn ornaments and a few thousand $ less in the bank!
“ the left front tire is visibly underinflated, which doesn’t paint the world’s most flattering image of maintenance”
Also quite dangerous.
That’s why you’re going to need a trailer.
I’ve heard that being as little as 1.5psi off can be quite dangerous for BMWs.
All you need is a digital tire gauge to avoid such perils.
Not dangerous until you drive the car. Which we’re not sure is even possible, because this thing could be a non-runner for all we know.
That’s why it’s called bring a trailer. Thebest legal caveat in the world.
“…an E28 M5 that recently hammered on Bring A Trailer for the incredibly low sum of $17,200…”
Well, that tears it. I’m just too old and too cheap for this hobby.
Just wait.
There’s a glut of vehicular opportunities that will soon be washing up on our poor people shores.
Take your vitamins. Do some cardio exercises.
Live long enough to watch the values plummet.
“Too old, too cheap?
Nah! Not yet.
Give it time…