It’s no secret that the definition of a classic car has shifted greatly as time’s gone on. A quarter-century ago, it pretty much only referred to chrome-bumper rides of 1973 and earlier, as Cudas, Impalas, E-Types, and ’32 Fords flocked to classic car events across North America. Now though, iconic rides of the ’80s have thoroughly risen in collector status, but owning a car from that era isn’t easy in every state. A recently introduced California Senate Bill aims to make classic car ownership easier in California by proposing easing of smog check requirements on classic occasional use vehicles, and it makes a lot of sense when you think about it.
Introduced on Feb. 21 and currently pending Senate referral, the bill has generated some buzz and attracted high-profile support including that of Jay Leno, who’s backing the bill. Let’s take a closer look at what it entails. In the digest for Senate Bill 712, it states:
Existing law exempts specified vehicles from being inspected biennially upon renewal of registration, including, among others, all motor vehicles manufactured prior to the 1976 model year. Existing law also exempts from specified portions of the smog test a collector motor vehicle that is insured as a collector motor vehicle, is at least 35 model years old, complies with the exhaust emissions standards for that motor vehicle’s class and model year as prescribed by the department, and that passes a functional inspection of the fuel cap and a visual inspection for liquid fuel leaks. This bill would delete the above partial smog check exemption for collector motor vehicles from existing law. Instead, the bill would fully exempt a collector motor vehicle from the smog check requirement if the vehicle is at least 35 model years old and proof is submitted that the motor vehicle is insured as a collector motor vehicle, as specified.
This seems like it would be a move with minimal environmental impact. After all, we aren’t talking about daily drivers here, as collector vehicle insurance is already fairly restrictive on use and mileage. For instance, Hagerty requires collector vehicles insured under its coverage to not just be a non-primary vehicle, but to also be used only for pleasure use, which means no commuting. As a result, people wouldn’t be able to use 35-year-old cars as everyday transportation to find a loophole in this proposal, but enthusiasts could stand to benefit from such an amendment.
To start, it may make a big difference for some privately imported vehicles. It can be a serious pain to get vehicles never sold in America to be certified by the state, as testing is require to ensure conformity, and modifications may be needed to get a vehicle into compliance, even if all factory emission equipment is intact. It goes without saying that compared to the American fleet at large, the portion of vehicles privately imported under the 25-year law is infinitesimally tiny.
This bill, if passed, would also make it easier for enjoyers of cars more than 34 years old to keep them on the roads in California, because smogging a pre-OBDII car seems like it’s been a bit of a nightmare recently. While a model year 2000 or newer vehicle with OBDII doesn’t require tailpipe testing, vehicles prior to that date but made after 1975 must pass a sniffer test.
Over the past few years, some owners of the latter vehicles have reported issues with finding a private testing facility able to accommodate their cars, some citing equipment issues and some citing shops just giving up. In 2022, one Nissan 240SX owner took to the NICOclub forum stating that “I went to 3 places and they all said the machine was broken and waiting on the repair guy.”
On a similar note, in a 2024 post in the Facebook group Californians For Classic Car Smog Exemptions, one user asked “Anyone know a smog shop that will still run OBD1 in SF valley in Los Angeles? my guy just called it quits on OBD1.” Beyond that, there’s sometimes a knowledge gap between newer techs and old smog equipment. As David Tracy pointed out in our Slack chat,
It is harder, and more expensive, to test pre-OBDII vehicles. That is true. And to be honest, you simply cannot expect new techs to be able to understand ancient smog equipment – smog pumps and EGR whatevers and vacuum tubes and all that.
California’s solution for the future is to move all pre-OBDII testing to state-owned facilities, and while that should result in less confusion over where to get the so-called BAR-97 test done, it may also result in less convenience for vehicle owners, as removing private smog shops from the program would reduce the number of locations owners can get a pre-OBDII car smogged at.
Of course, dropping the smog test requirement for older vehicles with collector insurance would come with questions about overall emissions compliance, but it’s important to consider feasibility instead of just malice. What happens when CARB-spec parts simply aren’t available anymore due to a car running far beyond its natural lifecycle? In theory, that car would be taken off the roads in California. In practice, it’s not that hard to flip over to another state’s registration before the next smog check is due if a car’s kept indoors most of the time and rarely driven, and while the risk of being caught certainly exists, people still do it all over California to keep what they love.
If Senate Bill 712 passes, it would be a boon to the private import community, a convenience to owners of older post-1975 collector cars, and should come at minimal social cost. It’s worth noting that prior to April 1, 2005, California had a rolling 30-year smog check exemption across the board, so this proposed legislation isn’t a complete rollback. If anything, it seems like a sensible proposal, so we’ll be watching what happens as it works through the legislative circuit.
Top graphic images: David Tracy; depositphotos.com
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On a side note, it sucks that Hagerty won’t issue collector car or agreed value policies if you don’t have a garage. If anyone knows of an insurer that will, I’d love to hear it.
I spend way too much insuring my MR2 Spyder because I haven’t found an agreed value policy.
To be fair, your Mr2 is a Toyota, so it’s reliable enough to be a daily driver 🙂
Maybe they think it’s like trying to insure a Miata as a collector car lol
Can you rent a garage nearby by any chance?
My ’90 single owner Miata has agreed-value insurance as a collector car with Hagerty. But yes, I do have a garage.
Also, it wasn’t always the rule. I guess it is due to theft risk but it just sucks. I have a driveway, so it doesn’t have to be street parked but no garage.
I got stated value on a commercial box truck from progressive.
Yes, I was shocked too.
Lots of restrictions, but a great rate through an independent agent.
I doubt they would insure a car, but who knows?
Not the same as agreed value I believe, it’s one of 3 options, normal, stated, and agreed I think.
They weren’t that specific.
It was expressed more as the coverage limit.
Values on that class are very volatile, might be as high as three times what I had covered.
Its very difficult to total a 13 ton truck unless you go off a bridge anyway
Thanks for the tip
Technically it was commercial insurance, but I was restricted to personal use only, and no other drivers.
Very good rate though.
Why not just bring back the rolling 30-year exemption?
California has, or used to have, an exemption for engines under 819cc (50 cubic inches), which includes the G&K gray market smart cars (but not the legit US-legal ones), and the i3 range extender (but not the i3s Rex)
A law that favors the rich, sponsored by the rich. What else is new?
How does this specifically favor the rich? It says that any motor vehicle at least 35 years old that has a collector automobile insurance policy will be exempt from emissions testing, pretty sure it’s not just wealthy people that own pre-1991 cars that aren’t used as dailies
Yes, it will benefit him, and also a lot of other people with 35+ year old collector cars who aren’t wealthy, I really don’t see how you can claim this is some sort of narrowly tailored carve out for the elite, when it’s clearly something that benefits a very large swathe of car enthusiasts
Bill Gates was the one who lobbied the US DOT and EPA to create the 25 year exemption for private imports, does that mean everyone driving a 1991 Honda Acty is a billionaire? I’d argue that that the vast majority of the people who have benefited from that arrangement aren’t
Thank you for mentioning an Acty. This law will not allow you to register the Acty in CA, unless it’s a collector’s car with collector’s car insurance (again, did you read the bill?). So tell me, how much money do you have if you can afford that?
The better law would remove all that nonsense about collector’s cars and collector’s car insurance. That would benefit the general population more. And we would be able to register all those sweet JDM cars in CA.
Car enthusiasts are not the everyperson. Not by a long shot.
You can get an Acty for like $6,000, so, I guess you need $6,000? Stated value collectors insurance is $200 a year for both of my cars, and they’re each worth more than that (well, one might be pushing it), so, yeah, that’s not exactly a member of the upper crust, to say the least
I don’t get why the collectors thing is a hangup for you, collectors insurance is way less than regular insurance, and collectors registration is way cheaper than a regular registration. I don’t use the latter, because I don’t want mileage restrictions, but it does save money. Weirdly, in my experience, most of the actual antique cars you see at shows have normal license plates, whereas collector car plates seem more common on like 1990s pickup trucks being run by landscaping crews (it’s not illegal unless you get caught)
He’s probably hung up on it because he’s too poor to have another daily driver car AND especially, a garage, which are pretty universal requirements for collector car insurance. And I get that annoyance, especially in a place as incredibly expensive to live as most of California. You have to be pretty well off to have a place with a garage in most of CA unless you bought it 20+ years ago.
Though I’ll say what I always say about the place – you can always move somewhere more affordable. I love the weather out there, but I don’t like ramen noodles enough to ever want to live there. And I would not make a single dollar more doing what I do living there than where I live now.
I don’t know, much of San Bernardino County is still pretty reasonable
Define “reasonable”. Where I am, right down the street is a new-build 4bd/2.5ba house with a two-car garage for $339K. i think it would have been better as a 3bd with larger rooms, and the garage is the usual waaay too small modern 2-car garage, but still.
I would venture a guess that the vast, vast majority of cars this would exempt cost less, and on average significantly less, than the cost of an average new car even if you bought that same classic car today – certainly much less for people who have held onto their cars for many years. Many of these cars are handed down through families, and many of these cars are really quite modest in price and appearance. In my case it would exempt a car for which I paid the princely sum of (checks notes) $5600.
If you’re rich and own an expensive car in California the problem isn’t smog, it’s registration and you’ll have a Montana LLC to take care of that which means it isn’t getting smogged anyway. So no, I must respectfully dispute your assertion.
See my reply above.
You seem to mistakenly think that people who insure with classic collector car insurance are uniformly rich. I insure through Hagerty because I’m a cheapskate and I can get full declared value coverage for $250 a year through them instead of the minimum $800 a year regular auto insurance would cost me for the same car.
Also, you also completely failed to address the point that the rich are going to register their expensive cars out of state and thereby avoid smog testing anyway. Plus, since we’re talking about cars from 1976 through the early 90s at this point, how many $100k+ collector cars from that era do you think are out there? When you think about collectors of cars from that era, think Radwood and not Pebble Beach.
As for Jay Leno: believe it or not, Jay Leno is a genuine car guy and he understands the Southern California automotive scene. He may be rich but he also knows there are a lot of us small timers out there with our modest malaise-era mobiles who preserve cars from that time because we think they’re interesting. I’m not sure why you see his endorsement as a bad thing.
35 years would include cars like a 1989 Volvo 240 or a 1990 Subaru Loyale, rich people aren’t owning something like that unless maybe they’re extremely eccentric, and those aren’t things you acquire through inheritance, they’re something you pick up for cheap from someone selling one in the parking lot of a strip mall at a busy intersection.
You will probably have a tough time getting collector car insurance for either one of those cars. Sometimes Grundy or Hagerty will do it for especially mint examples, but usually not. I had a really hard time getting AIG via Grundy to switch my MINT 35yo Land Rover Disco to the collector side of my multi-car agreed value police. And I only drive the thing a few hundred miles a year. I solved the problem by literally only insuring it for anything other than comp only when I was actually going to drive it. But it lives in a state where insurance and registration are not really tied together, I don’t think that’s the case in CA.
This is such a narrow-minded angle for this law. It’s not because it’ll benefit certain rich people (like Leno) that it also doesn’t benefit regular car guys.
The point is, no matter how rich you are, there are cars currently disappearing from California because of smog regulations. This law is a simple carve out for those few vehicles, owned by enthusiasts (of every tax bracket), to maintain their legality in California.
The collector insurance requirement is actually very clever. It ensures that the vehicles aren’t daily drivers and limits their mileage, which in turn limits their emissions impact. That’s the whole point of smog. This is an elegant and pragmatic solution for everyone involved.
Besides which, Leno is worth almost $500 million, he could afford to register every one of his cars on regular plates and put them on regular insurance policies if he wanted to. The lower fee for a collectors registration arguably is of much more benefit to the kind of person for whom paying one more annual registration fee on a rarely driven second car is actually a financial stretch, the collector car exception is actually of more value to regular car enthusiasts than it is to wealthy ones who can easily afford to pay whatever anyway
This. Exactly this. And as much as I can’t stand OBD-1 or feedback carbs or Motronic or D-Jetronic or inefficient GM-style cats on cars of that era— all of them could be replaced and upgraded. Even to (easily!) bring a car up to “modern” c. 1996 ish smog standard would be better for the air. Or putting on more efficient carbs. But THAT is illegal.
Let my friend drive their 1978 mgb please
I suspect the law was written for revenue enhancement purposes, but I don’t live in California and I drive a Prius. My first car was a used Saab 900S, and it probably wouldn’t pass.
If you listen to the diesel and Mopar guys carb is done now. They really should have had an exemption for collector cars years ago. Trying to maintain smog pumps that no one else is using decades after they haven’t been used in anything is pretty insane. Single market things. Virginia went with carb in 1967 but a 25 years and older don’t need emissions check and it’s not the whole state. They should have adopted that.
This proposal is useless to me because my actual first car that I managed to hang on to is a 1976. I want general use plates on it for that day when I eventually get it running so it can be a backup to my current daily driver.
Not necessarily, if you can get your car to pass emissions. Tough, but not impossible, there are 1976 models out on the the road right now that passed emissions inspection
In my state, it would have to just pass a simple curb idle test, have a cat, and not be leaking vapor out the fuel cap. 1968 models with basically no emissions controls besides PCV can pass the tail pipe curb idle portion of that
Getting the smog motor to pass in stock form is not a concern. Even in Commiefornia. My problem is I want to swap in an overdrive transmission and convert the carb to EFI for increased MPG. Under current law, those mods will fail the VISUAL inspection. Tailpipe test is not enough. It has to BE approved parts.
Yeah, that’s the problem I ran into trying to bring a UK market car in from out of state, new enough to require a cat for visual inspection, same drivetrain as US market Mercury Capri, and replacement cats are available for those, went back and forth with the DOT to see if it was acceptable to retrofit, only to find out, no, it is not. If the emissions equipment isn’t a factory install, you can’t have it. So, I bought something 20 years older that doesn’t need to pass anything but safety
I was unaware that it was hard to find a place to smog an OBDI-era car, I guess I’ll have to deal with that when I have to register my 1995 BMW 540i/6 California. It’s still a ways away from that 35 year mark and given that I drive 30k-35k miles a year with it, I’m not putting it on collector car insurance any time soon. It has stock cats on it and the evap system seems to work fine so it should pass in theory.
In theory. I’d recommend The Smog Shop in San Francisco.
I’d like to see something like that happen here, they say as goes California, so goes the rest of the country, so maybe this starts a trend. I’d like the ability to own something non-USDM from the mid 1970s, but we were pretty much the only country using catalytic converters at that time, so nothing else will pass emissions currently
Here in PA there is an emissions exemption for anything driven under 5000 miles a year. Honestly seems a reasonable compromise. The less populous counties do not require emissions at all, just safety inspection.
Shops with ‘broken’ equipment can be so tough.
Here in NY, a couple years ago they changed ALL the inspection computers to require facial recognition. Then they constantly broke. I tried 7 or 8 places that could do an inspection- short of dealerships- and every single one was broken. Why not fixed? Because there was ONE person that the state certified to fix them for 3 counties.
I’d like to see a return to the 35-year rule or something similar. Like others I have the story of calling a dozen shops for my 2024 test; seven didn’t have the equipment and four of the five that nominally could do it said their equipment was busted. The final shop was only willing to do it because I’d had the car done there before. And nobody even bothered to tell me I qualified for the fuel system inspection only option since it’s under classic car insurance. Folks, I live in San Diego in an area where there’s a smog check shop every quarter mile around me, but between “STAR” and non-“STAR” and pre-OBDII equipment issues it’s a struggle. What do people do that live in remote areas?
With that said Senate Bill 712 would do wonders for me so I don’t have to smog my ’88 Jaguar XJ6 that does less than 1000 miles a year and is insured as a classic car. By the way, my car passes smog with such flying colors it’s ridiculous. So doing the test just wastes time and money for me, and the trip and test itself causes some admittedly small amount of extra pollution along the way.
Now, since I like breathing cleaner air and I’m not a complete idiot there should be some caveats to the above. There should still be some sort of enforcement mechanism for obvious polluters that are throwing out billows of noxious exhaust. But at some point if you’re driving a 35 year old car you’re probably doing it either because it’s a classic or because you’re desperately poor; in either case maybe a break is in order.
My mechanic used to take my car to a place he knew and it was easy. Then his “friend” stop testing due to the difficulty and expense to maintain the dyno. Last time, he drove for hours looking for a place. Now he doesn’t do it anymore. So I went the Montana route. If Bill 712 passes, it would be great. However, as you can see here in the comments (only one guy so far), some people think all car owners are rich. So let’s wait for the bill to pass before we celebrate.
.
This article seems to make assumptions about this having no impact just on good vibes and no real evidence.
New cars are about 99% less polluting than old ones. Old cars cause a disproportionately large amount of air pollution.
Classic car insurance often has no mileage limits, so you very well could use it and still daily drive an old polluting car. The law itself needs to have strict mileage limits if we’re going to pretend this is only for cars that barely get driven.
Without smog requirements nothing will stop someone from driving around a misfiring catless heap that makes EVEN more pollution.
California cars live much longer than in the road salt states so we do have a lot of cheap cars from the 80s and 90s on the roads still, and a large number of people daily driving those cars as a means of cheap transportation.
This law will increase air pollution, the only question is how severely
That’s where I land on this too.
If you want to do something like this, just put mileage limits on the vehicle or limit the number of days it can be driven. PA does this by limiting the number of days per week the vehicle can be driven. They’ll call you out, fine you, and revoke the registration if you’re caught abusing the rules.
I 100% agree that if they do this, it should come with a strictly enforced milage limit.
Yep, seems like there should be some sort of standard, even if it is relaxed. I feel like I’ve seen studies that show that getting the 1-2% most polluting vehicles off the road makes a bigger difference than just about anything else. Even with a mileage cap, someone who only drives 1000 miles a year in something highly polluting will be doing more damage than potentially dozens of normally driven newer vehicles.
A bit ago, I did some basic math on the last emissions test on my almost 30 year old Jeep, which it passed, and realized that for criteria pollutants, the 1000 miles/year I drive it is roughly equivalent to 100k miles/year from a concept semi truck with ultra low emissions. And that was with (old) emissions controls, instead of none at all.
I wouldn’t believe numbers coming out of California regardless what they are.
The state that keeps passing physically impossible gun laws, then spending millions defending them?
Most states stopped smog inspections because they were not productive.
Smog equipment only exists to idiot proof cars that aren’t maintained in the first place.
I think of California as a state without human rights.
Now their refugees are driving up our real estate prices.
Classic car insurances, normally do not insure 35 year old Corollas or other commuter cars.
Again, just assumptions.
What would stop a company from offering insurance?
To put some real numbers on that statement: Looking at CARB emission certifications
1990 F150 5.0L (EO: A-010-0429)
HC – 0.50 g/mi
CO – 9.00 g/mi
NOx – 1.0 g/mi
Total – 10.5 g/mi
2025 F150 5.0L (EO: A-010-2563)
HC + NOx = 0.04 g/mi
CO = 0.5 g/mi
PM = 0.001 g/mi
Total = 0.541 g/mi
With brand new fully functioning emission controls that 1990 F-150 is putting out 19.4 times the pollution of the new F150. Or to put it another way driving 775 miles in the 1990 truck is equal to driving 15,000 in the new truck
You can’t tell me that people won’t daily drive a 1990 Ford F-150 or that if emmison testing wasn’t required people would spend money to put a new catalytic convertor on their old truck instead of put in a “test pipe”
Yup, but change the cat and put on a better ignition system that isn’t carb-certified and even if your 1990 car is exceeding its original specs – which it would be – your truck is now illegal in the state of California. That’s the problem.
For instance: If the requirement from California was “all vehicles made between 1976 and 1995 must upgrade their catalytic converters to [insert a cheap universal cat that could be CARB-certified]” instead of having to meet their original standards – an easy and effective upgrade, and loads cheaper than getting an OEM cat – that would be easy compliance. That would create a channel for products and avoid your “test pipe” issue. That’s a mandate that would work.
Instead an average on-the-brink day worker driving a 1993 Camry – a car that is relatively efficient and that will never die – has to make a choice of “do I scrap my car or lose a day’s pay trying to find a place to smog it”.
A. There is no way to know an aftermarket part meets or reduces emissions without doing emission testing. If a manufacturer does that testing then there is no reason not to do the paperwork to get CARB approval
B. There are plenty of CARB certified aftermarket cats. CARB does not require OEM parts.
Nonsense.
Enthusiasts maintain their car engines.
My heavily modified race engine passes 1993 smog tests with 500 hp.
Local test requirements?
I waited in line, produced ID and $40 for tags.
Went home.
You do.
Plenty don’t.
Can’t make sound laws based on anecdotes
If a car isn’t maintained
a. It ends up parked until someone cares enough to restore it.
b. It stops fairly quickly and stays that way.
Please carguysplain emissions to a 10 year master mechanic with a California smog license
The government rules requiring often counter productive designs specifically require meeting specs when even the most basic maintenance is ignored, ie ALL of it.
The last two petrol cars I bought had spark plugs at double the proper gap, and were about to stop running at all.
I wonder if the owners thought the cars were failing?
What?
Standards are designed for worst case scenario.
You have no idea what you’re talking about and blather on constantly to make yourself feel like you’re right.
Must be in middle management
Wrong again.
My job used to involve exhaust gas analyzers and this seems like the right move. The state facilities can have lab grade analyzers (unlike the cheaper stuff the shops used) and techs trained to maintain, calibrate, and operate the equipment properly.
Interesting comments on the collector policies. Wonder if I can get one for my 92 F-250. It’s a beater and I only put 1-2k miles on it but costs more to insure than the rest of my junky fleet (liability only.)
I can’t possibly imagine insurance on a 92 F-250 being a ton of money. This is interesting.
Common issue.
It may be the lack of air bags and ABS. The rest of the fleet has them.
It’s just because it’s older.
This is probably the best idea to come out of California in decades. Because of this, it won’t become law.
35 years ago was 1990. There aren’t that many cars that old still around and even fewer that are “daily drivers”. This proposal seems like a good idea. I’d be willing to drop the “collector car insurance” requirement as well. Just waive emissions requirements for cars over a certain age. It wouldn’t encourage anyone to trade their new SUV for an old car and it would benefit car enthusiasts.
I’m pretty sure California used to have a flat 25 years and older exemption for smog checks with no collectors insurance requirement that they did away with. The basic idea was that there were usually very few left and most that were still around were probably pretty well-kept so it wasn’t worth inconveniencing the owners. That was before inconveniencing drivers pretty much became the state’s mission though…
I’m generally in favor of emissions requirements. All you have to do is look at LA or Denver and compare them to what they used to be to see that the requirements are doing/have done a lot of good. I think that tying the requirement to age of vehicle is a much better approach than tying it to a particular year though.
Spent childhood in 1970s LA smog bowl. Can confirm.
Lived in Denver for 7 years and the brown clouds played havoc with my asthma. Your suggestion about age vs years is a good one.
CA has always had the 1976 hard exception. For a brief period in 2004 or so, the 35 years rolling exemption was implemented, but it was quickly rolled by by the The Governator.
Starting this week my daily driver is now a 94 Accord. Granted, I don’t do that much driving. In a state like CA, where nothing rots out, I think you see a lot older DDs with people who can’t afford any better.
Nice. I like the ’94 Accord. Unfortunately you still wouldn’t be emissions exempt though 🙂
I lived in Colorado for a long time (30+ years) and things don’t rust out there either, but there were still few cars older than 10 to 15 years. Rot’s not the only thing that destroys them. I also think that if someone can’t afford better than a 35 year old car, they probably shouldn’t be required to budget the $25 or whatever for emissions inspection, so that works out too.
In my state (Mass) we don’t emission test anything older than 15 years. The air quality is apparently good enough here without having to get any more strict than that.
The Accord is ok, would be great with a 5 speed. The 4 speed auto is very annoying, always downshifting when I don’t want it to.
Did you not read/watch DT’s carspotting blogarino yesterday?
https://www.theautopian.com/i-went-car-spotting-in-las-san-fernando-valley-and-discovered-chevy-truck-heaven/
Sure, he finds a lot of post 1990 “classics”, but he points out quite a few pre-90’s that look to be DDs.
I didn’t actually read it, but I’m sure that’s true. I don’t think there would be no DDs older than 35 years, just not a significant number. While I know they pollute more, the few of them there are probably aren’t enough to cause a problem.
I know the video was edited, but he commented that he and Griffin were only driving around for an hour and managed almost 30 mins of DT “certified classic” car content. That implies quite a few older cars out on the streets. As he states in the vid, California’s climate is conducive to long lives for their cars.
Well, as hard as it is to believe, I have been known to be wrong from time to time.
Sure, they’re around. That doesn’t mean they should be exempt. If they get used as daily drivers they absolutely should be subject to smog.
Not arguing whether DDs should be tested or not, just that there are a non-trivial number of people that this revised law may impact.
Avoid all the hassle: Montana LLC
That is a massive mileage limitation. IMHO the greatest meaning you can give a machine is a well used life. The mileage limitation relegates these cars to not being present in a lot of memories. Basically all my childhood I got to ride in very awesome collector cars for more than just a drive, whether it be me and my dad going to our favorite breakfast place, being dropped off at school, etc. Those are wonderful memories made possible because there were no mileage limits imposed upon us, just the limits the owner imposes upon their vehicle themselves.
Not every collector policy has mileage limits. Mine certainly doesn’t from what I read. The biggest deal to them is that the car isn’t the primary daily driver (and my policy stipulates that the car be parked in the garage).
Not a mileage limit, but they do have usage limits, as in, you’re not supposed to be using it as your primary vehicle and doing daily commuting with it
Not that I could do that anyway, my company requires that your daily commuter be 4 years old at the most
Not every collector policy has mileage limits. Mine certainly doesn’t from what I read. The biggest deal to them is that the car isn’t the primary daily driver (and my policy stipulates that the car be parked in the garage).
It’s a restriction on paper only. Good luck enforcing it. Oh, you put 10000 miles on your Midget this year? Sure, I took it to a bunch of shows and lots of weekend cruising. Totally not a commuter car.
Fair, but some insurance companies require occasional odometer readings. Grundy never has, but my Geico policy did (due to me having such low estimated yearly miles on my Tacoma)
That’s really funny. Geico did the same to me when I had a Taco that I rarely drove.
The import interference is now being extended to all cars through instructions to state DMVs at least under Biden.
DMV refused to sell me tags.
Turns out something prompted them to block my titled truck.
To be clear, the state turned down tax money!
Found it this was because it was off the road after vandalism.
My newer car was NOT blocked.
Weird anti-car shenanigans like blocking JDM cars.
Friend got a demand letter for higher taxes on the purchase of a car from 10 YEARS ago.
He paid full taxes on it.
Transmission failed and he had it scrapped years ago.
These are very strange monkey shines going on.
Why would it matter to GEICO?
They aren’t going to pay claims anyway.
…Because I had a full coverage policy that allowed me under 5K miles a year.
My Mercury insurance policy (not collector cars) asks me for mileage readings every year. I get a couple of bux knocked off my premiums for low miles. Right now, 2 of them are limited to 4200 miles/year.
In Texas, you no longer need an inspection of any kind – or an emission test – on cars 25 years or older. Now, only if you live on a metropolitan area do you have to pass an emission test. Live outside those areas and there’s no test or inspection of any kind regardless of age. 35 years for a California car is egregious. Those older vehicles are not destroying the environment. I love clean air but rules like that aren’t helping, they’re just buzz kills.
That’s kind of been California’s thing for quite a while now.
I am disappointed they decided to take away safety inspections. We can’t have complete junk rolling around roads anymore than Texas currently has.
Police can still cite visibly dangerous vehicles.
I agree and I think safety inspections are important. This also green lights diesels being deleted in areas where there are no inspections. I have a 22 year old car as my daily driver and I just installed a new catalytic converter on it to make it pass emissions. And I have absolutely no issue with that at all. Check engine light is off, gas mileage has improved and the car runs great. It wasn’t even very expensive.
I’m of two minds about the “inspection”. It appeared to me they really looked at much, and requiring a smog check on a brand new Prius with 24 miles on the odometer (had it trailered down from Chicago for reasons) before registration is patently absurd. That’s a revenue enhancement law…
Reading David’s earlier car-spotting article today before this one, how ironic that one of the best old-car ecosystems in the world is also one of the most difficult to own an old car in.
Here in WA, we did away with emissions tests years ago. Bad news for all the “pass a smog check for $49” shops that dotted the street leading up to the state facility. Where there’s a will there’s a way.
I’ve always thought of this as ironic, as well.
Wait, smog testing in CA can be done at private facilities?
When I need to get emissions done on my cars in IN, I’m interacting with the state’s finest only.
NC is all private inspection places, a lot of them seem to use inspections as an excuse to sell you crap with a failure as leverage.
“Oh, you failed inspection because you need new wipers, for $50 we can install new ones and you can pass.”
Truly a fantastic system.
Texas was like that when I lived in Houston and DFW. If you paid them the extortionate amount they wanted right then, you could pass. If you didn’t, they would fail you and make you pay to test again – either way they got extra money from you.
Yep! This is why I go out of my way to have inspections done at a particular shop; they’re busy enough that they don’t have time to pull stuff like that. There are plenty of places with more convenient hours closer to me, but I don’t know what I’ll be getting into with a new shop.
I don’t think I’ve EVER seen a non private test facility here.
Illinois smog check stations are state-owned.
https://www.ilairteam.com/
You don’t have the Hagerty restrictions quite right, but the rules are pretty vague. You can commute in the car and run errands, but it was explained to me that you need a primary car for each licensed driver in the household. Hagerty insures 2 of my cars. I certainly drive my 2006 Miata to work in the summer a few days a week and it sits outside my cubicle window under my watchful eye. I told them I drive it about 3,000 miles a year, and that seems to be about right. It’s considerably cheaper than my regular cars to insure. Generally they want the car to be 1980 or older, but they do insure newer specialty cars and apparently the Miata is one of them.
Here’s the part from their FAQ:
“Policies through Hagerty allow the collector vehicle to be used for club functions, exhibitions, organized meets, tours and even occasional pleasure driving — it just can’t be a daily driver. Regular driving to work and/or for errands up to 5 months a year as a Seasonal Driver may be considered.
Qualification for our classic car insurance program depends on vehicle and owner guidelines.
Usage and mileage requirements may differ based on the vehicle that is being insured, such as collector trucks or vehicles that are 1990 and newer. Please review specific vehicle guidelines for this information.
Mileage of 3,500 or less is generally consistent with operating vehicles that have collectible value. Mileage up to 7,500 may be considered.”
Hagerty seemed mighty accommodating when I inquired about a policy for my ’94 Fleetwood Brougham. After I sent them a couple of pics and explained that it’s used as a road-trip vacation-car, but otherwise is mostly a garage-queen they agreed to insure it with the usual agreed-upon value and usual great rate, but with the understanding that it occasionally gets driven halfway across the country and back. We agreed that 6,000 miles a year would be a good estimate.
Does this mean David can keep his J10?
I’m just going to fuel inject it and get some more power while I’m at it.
Nice!
I live in Colorado, which requires every vehicle from 1976 and newer to have working emissions, yet I do live in a county where we don’t have actual emissions testing.
I see all kinds of polluting rides (looking at you diesel), yet I think of my kids and their future. I make sure I’m compliant because I care. Also, exhaust stinks.
I worry that this loophole gets too big because I see that happening where I live.
I had a mechanic put in my Howell EFI kit on my Jeep CJ-5: I built my ride, but didn’t do this one modification. Why? I bought the EFI used, I don’t have a garage at the moment, its winter, and I want to drive my Jeep sooner than later because work and kids are using my time.
I personally rebuilt the carburetor a few years ago, it did great, but would fuel starve on long uphill crawls at 33 degrees. I get it back with my shiny EFI and the mechanic EGR deleted it to get the extra 1% performance, and it ran like crap. Honestly, I was not very happy; I should have done the install myself. $100 for an EGR valve, some vacuum line routing, some timing adjustment, new fuel filters, it is now running like a top.
I think I’m going to be in the minority here. I think having the state take on testing is the right move.
We have the same rule here, everything back to 1968 has to have a least a single stage idle test, and everything back to 1975 has to have a catalytic converter and pass the gas cap pressure test. It’s a little crazy, honestly, we salt the hell out of the roads every winter, anything pre 1990s, or, increasingly, pre 2000s is a rare sight outside car shows or an occasional spotting here and there. Since the rest of the world pretty much didn’t use cats until the 1990s, it pretty much means any non-US imports from the mid 1970s up to then can’t be registered here at all, and they don’t permit any attempts at retrofitting non-factory hardware. Show up in a Euro-market 1975 model with an aftermarket cat, that passes the curb idle test at the tail pipe and the fuel cap check, it will still fail because it didn’t have that cat from the factory
Say what you will about Jessie Ventura but as governor he did get rid of the smog checks in MN.
Ventura was a better governor than he was given credit for, it just turns out it’s hard to govern with literally no party support in the legislature.
It’s an instructive lesson in what would happen if a third party candidate actually managed to win the presidency.
My wife worked for him when he was the mayor and she said he was a great mayor.
Too bad Ventura was his own worst political enemy. He certainly did some things well, but could have done more had he controlled his mouth a bit more and gained better support from the two major parties. I knew plenty of folks who liked his politics and the way he governed, but didn’t support him because they hated listening to him speak.
How far we have fallen.
It’s cool that they’re doing this but I don’t see the necessity of the mileage restrictions. What percentage of registered cars in CA are over 35 years old? Most people won’t give up their creature comforts to drive 35 year old cars daily just avoid smog check.
I have some experience with this in the neighboring state of AZ. In my state, if you have the historic plate (which is a super cool looking copper plate that you can get for a car over 25 years old), and classic car insurance, you don’t need emissions. My 1994 Miata never needs another emissions test in this state, which is awesome (though it is still stock and compliant at the moment). The collector car insurance is awesome. My agreed policy through Grundy is 160 a year with no mileage restrictions. The only bummer is that the car needs to be parked in the garage every night (though, that’s where it lives, collector car policy or not).
I hope this passes for CARB states, as owning a collector car already comes with the headaches of owning something old (unobtanium parts, less mechanics who are willing to touch said cars, etc.). These cars aren’t putting the same mileage as they once did and the impact is minimal.
What do they qualify as a “garage?” We have a real, insulated, part of the house 3 car garage and we also have a metal barn with a garage door. I’m just wondering if they would see the latter as a garage.
Probably…