Welcome back! Today we’re sticking with the same-price theme, and looking at two cars for just under three grand that you’re probably not going to want. But they’re just what caught my eye today. And really, there are worse cars. Aren’t there?
Yesterday’s $5,000 German sedans were both pretty nice, and the positive comments seemed to be about evenly matched. But the big Benz won pretty easily, mostly due to its build quality, it sounds like. And thank you for the correction that the W126 still uses the old Citroën-derived hydropneumatic suspension system. I though it had been switched to a simpler air-ride setup by this point.
Actually, that knowledge makes me want it less. I know how to replace the BMW’s lower control arms, but I wouldn’t touch that Mercedes’s suspension system with a ten-foot breaker bar. Make mine the 7 Series. If I want a Sacco-era Mercedes-Benz, I’ll look for something with nice ordinary shock absorbers.
All right; time for some bad choices. It’s an underpowered malaise-era coupe with a transmission made of peanut butter versus an Eastern Eurpoean import based on a Fiat. You’re welcome.
1980 Pontiac Grand Prix – $2,900
Engine/drivetrain: 3.8-liter overhead valve V6, three-speed automatic, RWD
Location: Alhambra, CA
Odometer reading: 80,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives well
GM’s midsized A-body (later G-body) launched in 1964, and produced some seriously cool cars over the years: Chevelles, Cutlasses, and Skylarks, to name a few. They got bigger, then smaller, then outdated, and that leads us here: to the 1980 Pontiac Grand Prix. Powered by a Buick 231 V6, the precursor to the legendary 3800, this car boasts a whopping 115 horsepower, to haul around 3200 pounds. Speedy it is not. Worse, that milquetoast engine feeds the rear axle through one of GM’s more notable failures – the Turbo-Hydramatic 200 automatic transmission.
Ask an old-school mechanic about the THM200, and you’ll probably give them PTSD. It was meant to be a more efficient and lighter-weight alternative to the THM350, but it was severely under-built, and its failure rate was spectacular. Most of them ended up getting replaced by a 350 (or the lighter-duty version, the 250), but there are probably still a few 200s floating around. Both transmissions’ fluid pans have the same basic shape: a square with one corner cut off. If you want to know which one this car has, count the bolts around the perimeter of the pan: the 200 has eleven, and the stronger 250/350 has thirteen. If it only goes to eleven, you’d better plan on a transmission replacement eventually, especially if you upgrade the engine.
Transmission-related nerdery aside, this car doesn’t look terrible for an American car from 1980. The seat needs reupholstering, and the carpet isn’t in great shape, but the rest of the interior looks all right. I always liked the Pontiac dashboard more than the other A/G-bodies; I like the circle motif. This looks like a base model, so a lot of those circles probably hold idiot lights instead of gauges, but it’s still a cool-looking dash.
Outside, it’s a bit of a mess. I bet it looked pretty cool back when it was new, with two-tone paint, those sweet steel wheels, and no landau top, but time has not been kind to it. The paint has been touched up with a spray can, it looks like, there’s some damage to the driver’s door, and those soft plastic filler panels between the body and the bumpers probably left the chat ages ago. You can get replacements for some cars, but I’m not sure the Grand Prix is one of them.
1988 Yugo GVL – $2,900
Engine/drivetrain: 1.1-liter overhead cam inline 4, four-speed manual, FWD
Location: Palmdale, CA
Odometer reading: 77,000 miles
Operational status: Will start if you pour fuel in the carb, has been parked since 2001
Here we have the perennial whipping-boy at the top of so many “Worst Cars” lists, presumably among those who have never experienced a Dodge Aspen: the Yugo. Built in the former Yugoslavia, based on a Fiat design, and imported to the US by Malcolm Bricklin, the Yugo was supposed to be the next Beetle or Model T. It was the cheapest new car available in the US at the time, and it sold well – at first. But quality problems, political issues, emissions compliance issues, and the lack of maintenance so common to cheap cars doomed it.
This is the ever-so-slightly upmarket GVL model, which has some extra stuff standard but still uses the same 1.1-liter engine and four-speed stick as the base version. It’s an interference engine, with a timing belt that has a service interval of only 40,000 miles, which was part of the maintenance problems. Ignore the timing belt replacement, and the engine ate itself shortly afterward. A similar fate befell an awful lot of Fiat 128s, the car upon which the Yugo was based. At 77,000 miles, this car should be just about due for its third timing belt – but that’s not all it needs. The seller says this car has been sitting since 2001. It will run if you dribble gas into the carb.
Yugos are either “refreshingly simple” inside, or “depressingly cheap,” depending on your point of view. The material quality is wretched, but there’s also almost nothing to break. The worst problems with this one look to have been caused by the sun; not surprising considering its desert location. The seller makes a big deal of the fact that it has a Yugo-branded stereo. I wonder if it still works?
The outside looks presentable, but there is a little rust on the rear hatch, and the paint looks pretty chalky. Again, probably bleached in the sun. The seller says two of the original wheel covers are missing, but all I see are four matching Wal-Mart wheel covers. Me, I’d throw them straight in the trash. I’d rather have bare steelies than those hideous things.
Neither of these is a particularly wise choice, of course. They’re both pretty much crap, but sort of interesting crap, don’t you think? I mean, one is a symbol of Detroit having to be dragged kicking and screaming into the modern car era, and the other is a curiosity from a failed attempt to bring cheap wheels to the masses. They’d both attract lots of lookie-loos and question-askers at a car gathering. Which one is more your speed?
(Image credits: sellers)
Fresh off a timing belt job on my son’s car, I’m ready for that Yugo. And I have stuff to trade… too much stuff
A Yugo that’s a no go and has to be fed like a baby bird to get it running versus a Not-so-Grand Prix that’s been looking for a place to die since it rolled off the factory floor. And $2900? Not even in imaginary internet dollars.
Grand Prix, a junkyard LS, https://gbodyforum.com, and the Summit Racing catalog.
Grandpa gonna dust you at the next stop light.
I’m going Yugo because I like to suffer.
Don’t worry. If you like to suffer you can’t go wrong either way.
Had a ’78 GP (fancy SJ version, so no vinyl roof, bucket seats/console, actual ‘gages’ and a slightly stiffer suspension) for most of my years in college. Broke college student me really wanted to put something healthier into it than the Cal smogged 305 that it had, as I had a THM350 swapped in out of necessity, like so many others. Middle-aged me would love to have that car back and tastefully retro-mod it. I’ll cast a nostalgia vote for the Pontiac.
The GM G-bodies were a great platform at the time. You can swap in just about any GM V8 and even the late LS motors.
Going Poncho – loved the style of these as a little kid. I did think they had the best G-body dashboard. There are a million options from mild to wild to repower if wanted. I’d probably go an aftermarket TBI 305/350 with a TH700R4 to keep up with modern traffic. I’m not a drag racer. I could be tempted by a 5 speed manual but doubt it suits the car, this is a cruiser.
BTW – not sure this is a base model, it has power windows in a time when Armstrong ruled the day.
You’re not wrong about that dash. All. Those. Binnacles. It was this domesticated racecar look (fake wood paneling b/c classy) that’s just irresistible.
I feel like at this point you’d only buy a Yugo for one of two novelty reasons-
As a side note, only 25% depreciation on a non-running, 30+ year old car is pretty crazy. Who knew?
The 1.5 swap isn’t quite a drop in from what I’ve heard but not particularly difficult either. Yugos only weigh like 1800 pounds so they feel pretty sprightly with any bump in power. My stock ’91 Plus got the fuel injection to get to 67hp, it wouldn’t take much to make the car entertaining.
I’m old enough that I test drove a brand new one in maybe 92, and it was decently fine, but I remember it being pretty underpowered. But it was just so cheap. I ended up with a Toyota, but I still think about doing something stupid to a Yugo from time to time
I test drove one when they first debuted in 1986. There was nothing fine about that car. The hood release handle came off in my hand, and the seat supports were pre-rusted from the family. Brand new it didn’t run properly, it would barely idle. Slow doesn’t even being to describe them – a diesel Rabbit was faster. $4K was simply nowhere near cheap enough.
I want my Yugo to prove that Doug DeMuro is an idiot.
Do it, and then he can make a 45 minute video explaining how you did it in excruciating detail.
I though that was proven long ago.
Some things don’t need to be proven, they simply are.
I disagree. I want a Yugo because I find them interesting. I go to a lot of car shows and can honestly say I have no interest in seeing yet another ’57 Chevy or ’65 Mustang. I have literally seen hundreds of classic Mustangs since I last saw a Yugo.
Unintentionally rare cars (i.e. not cars built in low volume but high-volume cars that were regarded as disposable and not preserved) are something I really enjoy seeing. This is a car I would take to car shows. Everyone knows about the Yugo, but most people know them more as a myth or a punchline than as a car. I think people might enjoy seeing an actual Yugo instead of just reading about them on “worst cars” lists. Cars like this are a great conversation piece.
Also, I unironically like Yugo styling. Taste in cars is subjective (and my taste in cars might be bad), but I like cars with very simple styling. This car is about as simple as you can get.
100% agree. Some people see cars like this as kitsch, but a survivor X-body for example is to me more fascinating than yet another cliche car show queen.
I think every car tells a story – and the Yugo’s is quite fascinating. Spending time with a car and getting to know it tells you a lot about the purpose for, and the time in which it was made, and the people who designed it and put it together. Even with the Yugo, they took it seriously. I’ve interacted with people from Serbia while sourcing parts for mine, and it’s notable that the Yugo was a source of a lot of pride for the people in the area, even still today.
I get that, because I don’t think I’ve seen a Yugo in person since the 90’s, and I see the more ‘popular’ classic cars pretty much every day.
I rode in many cars like this Pontiac—even had a Cutlass Calais with a gutless 260 V8. No hate for them, but would require more power if I were to own one. Voted Yugo, because, while also lacking power, it’s at least tossable.
Dude I clicked on the Yugo ad and it says: “Title status: lien”. Fucking why.
Also, telling us it ran when parked in 2001 is pointless information. The junkyard is full of cars that ran in 2001. That was 23 years ago.
Despite this, I’m picking the Yugo. Even fixed up, the Pontiac is boring as hell, and I say this as a Pontiac guy. Yugos are dirt simple, this one can be cleaned up relatively easy. Drive it around and you will get constant reactions to it, most of them good. Take it to a car show, park it next to a Chevelle and steal all the thunder. I speak from experience. Get a timing belt before you do anything.
Damn: I’d like to hear the story behind that lien!
I mean, who would loan money on, or secure a loan with, a Yugo? Maybe a mechanic’s lien?
My guess is that someone took out a loan on it decades ago from a credit union and then never went to get the credit union to sign the title when the payments were up. I had that happen to me when I bought a $300 Lincoln Town Car from an estate sale and neither the previous owner nor the credit union were still around to correct the issue. Luckily, I got my $300 back when I sent it to a salvage yard.
Or they took out a title loan, and the shady place went out of business before they got their lien released.
Or they just clicked on the wrong drop-down item when posting the ad.
So this could be that ethereal scenario where the seller might actually need help selling their car?!
LOL, I have actually been the guy selling a vehicle for a friend several times. My one buddy is completely incapable of selling things, so when he wants to get rid of something, I get the call. I sold both a scooter and a motorcycle for him this summer. Just a couple days ago I sold an NOS fan shroud for a ’78-91 Panther car with a 302.
Indeed – I have a friend who has sold a couple cars for me. He enjoys it, has waaaay more free time than I do, and he always gets waaay more money for them than I would, because when I am done with a car, I want it GONE. I give him 10% of whatever he gets for the car.
The last time was a ’79 MB 300TD wagon that I probably would have sold for $4K – he got *$10K* for that thing from some guy on the other side of the country who paid to have it shipped in an enclosed trailer. It was nice, but it wasn’t THAT nice.
Yeah, we have a similar situation.
I’ve never gotten him THAT much extra, but if I don’t sell whatever it is, it will sit at his place FOR-EV-ER.
I was *shocked* by that Mercedes. He found the one dude who really, really wanted a rare non-turbo wagon with very low milage and was willing to pay. I think it had 70K on it when most of them are more like 700K.
AWESOME!
Could be.
But do we ever get that lucky?
If you’re gonna be a Prix, may as well be a Grand one.
Pontiac for me.
I want a Yugo for some reason. There is no way I could turn down this car for $2,900 if it were for sale locally. I have no idea what this car is actually worth, but for $2,900 I can’t be overpaying by that much.
I hate to admit it, but same.
Yugo, if only b/c it was Nick’s improbable but fitting car in an underrated romcom with a killer soundtrack, Nick and Norah’s Infinite Playlist. His was the more desirable orange, but beggars and all that.
“You don’t have to yell, it’s not a train station…we’re in a tiny car.”
Oh wow. My favorite aunt had an ’80 GP like this with the 3.8 and two-tone burgundy and cream paint that crazed like a ceramic vase about 2 years after she drove it off the lot. The only options it had were bucket seats and an in-dash 8-track player.
She kept that thing until 1998! as a second beater car. You couldn’t fill the gas tank more than half way or it would leak.
‘Will run poorly longer than most cars run at all.’
I also want to save that Mercedes-Benz SL W107 in the grass behind the Yugo!
Good God these are two awful, overpriced choices.
I guess I’ll take the Pontiac but only if the guy loses the “2” our of the price…
The Yugo is only to have out of novelty. Even swapping out the transmission, and cleaning up the Pontiac with far more available and cheaper parts you would have what I think is an objectively better car that I could see being completely usable.
I love how everyone thinks old American cars are heavy pigs. This one weighs like 700 pounds less than a current Civic.
They were garbage, just not heavy (by today’s standards) garbage.
Yeah they were massive, but basically made of tin foil and they have the structural rigidity of a wet origami crane so there just wasn’t a lot in them to weigh a lot
But it was 1000lb heavier than a Civic of the time. Which is why they are considered heavy pigs. That modern cars are even heavier pigs is neither here nor there.
Most of the times I’ve heard it, it’s from modern car people who wouldn’t remember the contemporary Civic. They just see the looks of the American cars and assume they’re as heavy as they appear.
I think the big steel bumpers make them look heavy, but they also made parking dings nothing to worry about.
I was gonna go Pontiac, but that V6 three speed is so uninspiring and the rest of the car isn’t good enough to motivate a re-power.
I’ll take the Yugo. I have no experience with it, but something in me wants to cram more power into it with either a motorcycle or honda engine swap. Then just hoon around with reckless abandon while I get weird stares in traffic.
One day, I will vote against a Pontiac in a SBSD. Today is not that day.
The amount of work needed to revivify a Yugo that’s been sitting for 20+ years seems out of proportion to its value or utility … though if that Yugo radio still picks up Pravda, that might not be a bad call right now.
But I can see the potential in that GP (and Tucker, I think it does have a Landau top, though the pictures are abysmal), and that two-tone paint is sweet, so we’ll take the Poncho.
Yugo, because I happen to know that if you break down on the side of the road, there’s likely all the parts you’ll need to fix it right there.
I have the Pike car and the VW Beetle, but I need the Yugo to be even more like JT!
Wow. Ok yeah you win, you made me vote for a malaise era car.
It seems when both choices suck, you can’t be happy either way. Oh wait we’re talking cars here, sorry.
The only way to win this game it not to play. The correct answer here is *niether*, because they both completely and utterly suck and have prices with a decimal point two spaces too far to the right. Especially in the case of the non-running Yugoslavian turdmobile with a lien(!!) on it. Not even for free for either one of them.
I go, Yugo, we all go SLOW
Given these two choices I’ll rebuild the excitement.