I really could replace my 1966 Ford Mustang’s exhaust by myself. All the parts are available, and I’d just use a bunch of clamps to squeeze it all together; it really would be no big deal. And yet, here I sit at a muffler shop in Van Nuys, California about to be out $800. That’s a lot of scratch! And it hurts! I’m not sure I like this feeling, and I’m a little worried it could become the new normal.
As has been made clear in a number of my previous articles: My life has become a bit more complicated than it was before in Michigan, where I was a single man with only one job: make content to feed blogs. Delicious, juicy, click-inducing blogs. As a result of that life’s simplicity, I had lots of time, which meant I could wrench. Non-stop.
Nowadays I have more responsibilities as EIC of The Autopian, plus I have a more complex personal life. So time is hard to come by, which means I can’t wrench as much as I used to.
There are some jobs that I will not pay for. Brake work? For get it; I’m doing that myself. Engine work? I got that; I’m not going to spend thousands to have someone else do work that I may not have faith in. I know that, if I do the job myself, it’ll be done properly.
There are some jobs, though, that require a specialist. Brazing up a bad radiator? I’ll have an expert handle that. Paint? Yup, an expert. Aligning my car? I could use a tape measure, but why not just have an expert with laser machines do that? Exhaust?
Well, exhaust I could just do myself. Check out the hole in this thing:
As this exhaust shop here in Van Nuys points out: This thing needs a whole new exhaust. The pipe is as thin as paper. And, what’s more, I hate the location of that muffler; it’s right up against the fuel hose.
I could get a whole new exhaust, though, for only $330! And I’d just put it all together and clamp it with some U-Bolts. It’d take some time (which I don’t have), but it’s really not that hard of a job.
But I don’t have time. My brother (the spiritual owner of this Mustang) is flying in on Thursday, and I want him to enjoy his car for the first time (yes, he’s never driven it). So this shop is going to do an entire new exhaust — a big one 2.5-inch one with a Flowmaster 42441 repackaged ahead of the axle — for $800. A bit dear, yes, and I kinda regret not having haggled, but hey, it’s where we’re at.
As someone who typically does his own work on his cars — including exhaust work – I feel really weird. As a certified cheap bastard, I hate spending money, but I need to remind myself: I do almost all other work myself. I’ll be swapping the master cylinder myself later today. That’s saving probably at least $150. I tune my own carbs, I do my own electrical — I can pay someone to do my exhaust every now and then, right?
Why do I feel so bad about this?
[looks into wallet]
Oh yeah, that’s why.
Exhaust is one of those things I don’t mind paying for. Pro welds are nice- the one time I did a system myself with slip joints they slipped on their own after they were done.
I feel ya. As someone who has historically done most of their own car work and is sometimes distrustful of others touching my vehicles, it has been hard for me to relent that my time is now often worth more than money and pay someone for work I could do myself, but I’m adapting. I recently replaced basically the whole front suspension of my 2004 Sequoia and did all the work myself except for getting ball joints and wheel bearings pressed in. I conceded that I didn’t have the right equipment (I could rent it admittedly) and can be a PITA job if anything goes wrong. Then I got sticker shock at the final price because I didn’t know what current labor rates were like, which then reaffirmed why I do most of my own work, but there is definitely a place and time for me to hit some problems with my wallet instead of my wrench.
David, aside for the fact that I cannot stand to negotiate (as a salesperson, I feel the customer is basically devaluing my knowledge/contribution to the transaction, and I refuse to treat others that way), think of all the money you’re NOT spending by doing all the other work yourself – not to mention all the other things you can do with your limited time instead of cursing through the night at an old (awesome) car’s exhaust.
Think happy thoughts!
Could I have bought all the river rock, trees and shrubs and put it down in my mulch bed myself? Yes. Did I? Fuck no, my back is shot and my wife would kill me.
I quote myself a labor rate. If its going to take me more time when I can do something else more productive, I would rather pay someone to do it. But if the repair price is insane, I will figure out a way if I can do it (Still debating to pay $550 to replace a parking sensor on the Polestar 2 or just let the dealer change it, I have to look how hard is to replace it).
The replacing is probably the easy part. The calibration and making sure the software is working properly is the unlikely thing hiding under the bed.
Just having this debate: DIY vs Dealer on my wife’s Subaru Crosstrek sparkplug replacement…PITA vs ‘did they really replace that really hard one on driver’s side?’
As I get older, less things feel worth my time to do myself, but for car stuff, I still feel like I fail a bit whenever I pay someone else to do them.
Holy Cow! Torch and David both responded to my comments in the same day! What do I win?
A coupon for $20 off any exhaust replacement at your local Meineke Car Care Center.
Yeahhhh
Does that arrive the same day as the Bed Bath & Beyond coupon?
David, I totally feel you. My Sportwagen is getting new lowering springs and upgraded shocks installed at some point soon…and I’m not doing it. I think this is the first time I will be paying someone to do something on my car that I am capable of doing myself. And it feels great, honestly. I did the same job on my GTI over ten years ago so I know I can do it, but it was a bitch of a job and I don’t want to do it again. While it’s at the shop, I’m also paying to have the timing belt replaced. I was gonna diy that too, but after reading the DIY, it will be well worth the money I spend to have it done. To be honest, this is also the first time in my life I’ve even been able to afford having a shop do that much work on my car.
Look at it this way: you’re being a good brother.
You do realize that’s tomorrow, right? 🙂
D’oh!
I’m still doing the master cylinder myself. Probably.
Working on automotive brakes isn’t really my thing, but I recently learned about bench bleeding the MC – pretty nifty.
(It’s kind of a misnomer as it is installed but not yet connected to the brake lines)
Working on cars has taught me a whole lot about bleeding.
Question to DT.
How long have you known your brother was coming to town?
Question from my wife in heaven here.
WTF did you wait till the last minute?
Will you ever learn?
Sorry, sometimes she takes over the narrative in my head.
Good luck, DT. (you crazy bastard)
Sometimes, I just write the check. I’m old and I can afford to pay someone to do something I don’t like so I can do something else that I do like to do.
No shame in having someone else install a muffler system for you.
Not yet old, but suspension and exhaust are not worth the hassle, particularly in PA . My MDX needs new front struts, when it goes in for inspection next month I’ll say fix it. There is work I enjoy and work I don’t.
Yeah it comes with age and means (deserved or not). Sure I could do it myself, but is it worth my hourly rate?
In the picture of the exhaust hole, what is that spring doing?
I reckon that’s part of the park brake mechanism.
If you aren’t careful, you are gonna start going bald with all this worrying.
Laugh it up. 🙂
Ha! It’s my birth week, by law that means I get to talk some shit.
I was balding and greying by David’s age. I’m now “distinguished”. Never trust an engineer without grey hair.
True. I’ll allow it.
It’s a sign of virility.
This afternoon some mechanic’s blog will have a post entitled “Some Guy Is Paying Me $800 to Work on His 1966 Mustang and He’s Wringing His Hands and Muttering to Himself”.
And he keeps saying he is so poor that he has to live in an old Aztec…
I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again. It’s OK to pay sometimes. There is no shame in being capable of doing something, but not having the time, energy or desire to do it. I’ll do pads and rotors, but I’ll pay someone $100 to get covered in brake fluid doing a flush.
David not only saved time now by not installing the new exhaust but also saved time later by not having to buy his brother birthday or X-mas gifts (possibly for multiple years).
…genius!
Avoid buying Christmas or birthday gifts with this one weird trick…
85 pages of background story, a tweet at the end.
This is how it starts. . .next thing you know you own an old house (that needs a lot of work), a kid or two and all the places they need to be, work load never gets less no matter how many times we say “If I can just get through this week”. . .next thing you know, you sold your project car and the shop is doing all your work cause you have a work dead line due and you need your car to go out of town tomorrow.
Don’t scare me like this!
I’m transitioning to empty nest – can confirm. I’ll also say the voyage is 1000% worth it. I would not trade my daughter for anything, even if she drives me nuts.
Ah, and the fun of trying to troubleshoot out of town daughter’s car over the phone…usually will involve a video at minimum.
“There was a warning message but I didn’t read it. It’s gone now”
uhh…?
It works both ways old-timers =P
IT support for mom/dad/gparents over the phone or via email isn’t for the faint of heart either.
No joke! When my Mom was in early stages of dementia, I had pictures of her remotes/phone screen on my phone so I could direct her to which buttons to push to fix whatever the heck she had messed up.
That’s right, those 10+ yo flip phones aren’t gonna fix themselves!
Finding a battery every few years is always an adventure.
That’s why Toyota is the answer.
Can confirm.
Time is money. There’s no shame in spending one when you don’t have the other.
When it comes to choosing what to do myself vs paying someone else, I always “charge myself” $25 an hour labor. If I end up thinking it will take me 6 hours at $25 ($300 total), but know someone else can do it in 3 hours for $50 an hour labor, then I’ll have the other person do it. If I need to do something late into the night because of work/family requirements, I’ll consider a overtime rate for myself.
You are not paying yourself enough for your labor!
There is no joy in exhaust work, without a lift you are laying on your back wrestling a muffler and pipes into place. Let the experts handle this – you’re good.
Exhaust work really does suck. It’s not just the rusty bolts (I’m an expert at handling those), it’s actually trying to get the damn pipe over that axle, which — without a lift — is really joyless.
I’m at the point I leave most exhaust and suspension work to the shops. I like and take pride in doing my own work, but there are things there is no return on.
Yeah, I was all ‘I’ll do my own exhaust!’ last time. The rusty bolts won, so I took it to the garage.
I replaced the exhaust on my Defender recently. On my back in the driveway, jacking up the rear to get clearance. It was fun! And I didn’t have to pay anyone!
Came home from college one weekend and 2 of my friends were in my mom’s garage installing headers on a Cougar with the front end precariously perched about 6 feet in the air on anything they could find. I closed the garage door and walked away…
This comment right here proves you made the correct decision. If you can pay someone else a couple hundred dollars to do something that is joyless it is money well spent.
Do as I say, not as I do. Just patched the exhaust on the Corolla with a wide SS band clamp dues to a rusted out flange. I cut off both sides and used the clamp to bridge the gap. I figure I can replace it myself later this way rather than getting it welded and being hosed later.
I respect the ingenuity.
I’m a cheap bastard at heart with an engineering degree – a dangerous combination if I may add.
Holy Cow! Torch and David both responded to my comments in the same day! What do I win?
I hate working on exhaust, I always end up spending several more days chasing exhaust leaks.
When I bought the Land Cruiser I remember reading on the forums someone saying that people should be able to do all the work on it themselves. I thought that was nuts. Who do you think I am?! I’ve gained a lot more confidence on my skills and its come in handy in a pinch as well as in the wallet, but there are still some jobs I don’t mess with. I personally hate dealing with brake fluid, so I don’t. body work? HELL NAY. Anything chassis I can handle but the big bits (engine and transmission) I generally leave alone except for ancillary stuff.
I didn’t realize the stock muffler position was after the axle; how long was that a Mustang thing? I guess I always just assumed they were before.
Probably cause we never see stock Mustang exhausts, haha
Your time is worth money too and you can’t buy any more of it after it’s gone.
I can do my own oil changes, especially on these new Subarus with the oil filter right on top of the engine, but when I compare the time to go buy the oil and filters, jack the car up, put down the cardboard and slide the catch can underneath it and drain it, then prep the filter while waiting for it to finish dripping, fill it all back up, clean up my tools and myself, then take the damn catch can down the street to the autoparts place to drain it…
Well I could also just take it to a reputable oil change place and pay them $$ to do it for me and get the tires rotated and a carwash thrown in. The older I get the better I am at suppressing my inner cheap bastard.
I did an oil change on the Mustang last night. Cost me a total of like, $18. But I had to drive to Van Nuys, grab some ramps from across the parking lot, drive the car up the ramps, get all the supplies. It took me about 90 minutes with travel accounted for.
I do it primarily because, at least for now, it’s still worth my time, and I actually enjoy it. But I could see how, as life becomes more complex, even something that simple could become a burden.
What my inner cheap bastard considers a burden or worth doing is interestingly selective. Had a leaky toilet a few months back, I’ve replaced wax rings before and could do it again but I just didn’t feel like dealing with it so I called a plumber. Shortly after that the garbage disposal crossed over into Sto’Vo’Kor which is arguably a harder job than the wax ring but my ICB jumped right on that project and next thing you know I’m under the kitchen sink cussing about how much I hate plumbing. ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯
Toilet: Heavy, bad consequences if you get it wrong and you might not know for a while. Garbage disposal: Not so heavy, if you get it wrong you can easily and quickly see where and fix it immediately.
Next time I have to do a toilet I’m calling the plumber around the corner because I have zero desire to lift one again.
It’s amazing how many toilets are fully caulked around the bottom. I’d rather see the leak on the bathroom floor right away than have it dump into the internal flooring somewhere.
Definitely don’t want to do the wax ring wrong, although they’ve made some nice improvements to make it easier if you aren’t great with lining up the simple ring.
The in-sink-aerator style are super easy to replace if you are doing a 1 for 1 exchange and leave the old sink flange in place. I replaced one while on a work call during the pandemic. I even read the directions and put the dishwasher port gasket in the right place, which the original plumber did wrong, and got rid of a small leak under the sink. Other brands do seem to be more difficult to replace.
I put in an insinkerator so if it needs to be replaced (hopefully not) it should be easier.
Cheap Bastard will come give me crap about it like last time no doubt, but I pull the car in to the same place where I get my yearly inspections done as I’m driving on the way to work, wait 10 mins, and the oil change is done.
My tools wouldn’t even be out and back in the sheds/basement that fast. Plus I only have a carport and it’s either too damn hot or too damn cold most of the time. Screw that. Well worth the $59.99+tax. And no fluids need to be carted/spilled anywhere.
I have done and would consider doing oil changes again in the future if something changes, but not having a garage makes everything more annoying. Can’t even imagine for those without a carport or driveway.
I say call it a win. You avoided a trip to the parts/tool store, and if you’re anything like me, you’re probably going to buy something there you don’t need for THIS current car project. So you saved all that additional money too =)
So if is $800 with the parts for the exhaust and installed? That isn’t to terrible actually. If a cheap set cost $330 most likely not stainless and you have to use clamps so more chances of leaks.
It’s for the whole custom exhaust installed, yep. I don’t think it’s stainless.
Yeah that sounds cheap for stainless. I did a custom 2.5 dual on my firebird 7-8years and that cost about if I recall $1.2k then for a cheaper grade stainless. Going to get it pulled off soon for a single though for a single 4in and all the parts for the single 4in have cost me about 700 bucks and most of them are not stainless. So yeah don’t feel bad for 800 for an installed exhaust that isn’t bad at all.
I spent too much time stressing last year when I needed a new exhaust – I had picked out a $1,200 stainless high performance exhaust, and was debating if I really wanted to get rust in my eyes and back pain from squeezing under the tight to the ground car. In a bit of a whim I took it for an estimate at the local custom exhaust place who quoted me $750 and 45 minutes. I should have negotiated down a little it took two guys like 30 minutes – these guys were like a NASCAR pit stop – only complaint is that they cut off the front flanges so now I am stuck going back to custom exhaust unless I want to replace the Cats. It is regular steel, which isn’t really what I wanted, but they did go bigger diameter than stock and put a much better combiner in, so I pretend the performance is better ;-). They did warranty the work for two years, which is longer than my “Elise” wants me to keep the car (and I am at least two years into delaying this already).
You’re not paying for the exhaust work. You’re paying for the receipt, which you will submit to your brother for reimbursement, or at least casually leave on the driver’s seat when you hand him the keys if you like to avoid confrontation and trust that he has any kind of ethical sense.
He’s the EIC of a for-profit website that posted a car blog about buying an exhaust as part of their business. He paid for a receipt, but it ain’t to send it to his brother.
If only it were a company car.
Congrats. Enjoy the fruits of someone else’s labour.
Farewell, David, we hardly knew ye.
What’s next, using Uber Eats to order pasta instead of having shower spaghetti?
He still expects it delivered to the shower tho.
I hope he tips any delivery driver willing to do that very, very well. 🙂
I think I’ve seen a video like that before.
I don’t remember pasta featuring prominently in “The Golden Shower Girls”….