If there’s one market where you’d expect a historically gas-guzzling American brand like Jeep to falter, and an eco-friendly brand like Tesla to thrive, it would be Europe. And, for the last few years, you’d be mostly correct. Jeep has had mixed results in Europe while Tesla sales have grown. It was expected, with competition, that Tesla’s share of the market would moderate, but something happened in the last few weeks that has caused the company to absolutely nosedive.
What could it be? There are a lot of reports, and some data, that show it’s political. I’m less interested in this as a value judgment. It doesn’t matter if you love Elon Musk or hate him. What’s fascinating to me is that a company has gone from being a symbol of the eco-left to an association with the hard-right. Nowhere is that clearer than in the EU, where Tesla sales in January dropped more than 50% year-over-year.
That’s one way a CEO can absolutely trash a company. If you’re a regular here at The Morning Dump Cafe, then you’re aware of some other ways. Carlos Tavares saddled Stellantis with a plan that made no sense, which is going to result in another tough year according to the company. Lucid’s CEO Peter Rawlinson is someone we like around here, though he’s not going to come around here as much as he used to.
And, finally, Aston Martin’s CEO is in the process of turning the company around, though it hasn’t turned around yet.
‘I Felt Nothing But Disgust’ Complains European Tesla Owner
Cards on the table, I was expecting Tesla to lose about 20-25% of its sales in the European Union countries in January. That would be a big swing from December, when Tesla’s year-over-year sales were up 5.9%. With electric car sales still climbing in Europe, even a 20% drop would have been a big deal, but I could have probably buried the story deeper in The Morning Dump like I’ve been doing lately.
The combination of production slowdowns due to planned model upgrades and increased competition would have made that 20% seem bad, but not so bad that it’s the first thing I had to talk about this morning.
That’s not what happened. Here are the latest numbers from Europe’s car industry association (ACEA), and it’s so much worse than I guessed. For the EU countries, BEV sales increased by 34% year-over-year in January. Add in the EFTA countries and the UK, and you get a 37.3% increase. It’s a great time to sell electric cars in Europe.
Unless you’re Tesla. In the EU as a whole, Tesla sales dropped by 50.3% and the company’s total market share there dipped below 1.0%. That’s real bad. The American automaker only sold 7,517 cars. By comparison, Jeep sold 9,935 (including the EV version of the Avenger). Suzuki sold 12,395. Mazda, which also had a rough January, outsold Tesla by about 400 cars. Things are a little better when you add in the EFTA countries and UK, with Tesla only dropping 45.2% year-over-year.
Again, this isn’t great, and the market noticed, with Tesla shares dropping about 8% yesterday and the company dipping below the $1 trillion valuation it once had. There are a lot of buyers out there looking to pick up Tesla shares when it sinks, so I wouldn’t be surprised if Tesla comes back a bit today. More than any other modern company, Tesla is less tethered to business fundamentals and p/e ratios. CEO Elon Musk is a dreamer and, if you believe that dream, you typically make money.
It’s also just one month. Tesla can lower prices. It can start taking deposits for some kind of “affordable Tesla” that’s maybe a decontented Model 3 or something. Options exist. Again, though, the premise of Tesla is that it’ll keep doing amazing things forever. Owning shares in the company, like being a Mets fan, is an exercise of faith in the face of increasing uncertainty. Remember, Tesla famously does not pay dividends. So what happens if that faith goes away? Tesla isn’t worth nothing because, even with all of this, it’s still a profitable company. It does become a more “normal” company, perhaps, with a valuation more grounded in its earnings-per-share.
So here’s the thing I didn’t want to write that I’m going to write anyway. This is about politics. There are a lot of reasons why Tesla was always going to be less competitive, but it doesn’t happen this fast or this dramatically without some other cause. And there have been signs, like polls showing Elon Musk becoming increasingly unpopular with certain people. Then there’s California, where buyers have started to turn away from the automaker. Given that Tesla still sells a lot more EVs than the next few automakers combined in the United States, it’s been easy to dismiss this as a problem around the margins.
For instance, here’s a whole article in Bloomberg talking about Tesla owners in California getting angry about owning a Tesla:
“I don’t know if there’s ever been a greater destruction of brand equity in this short amount of time,” said Tom Price, a resident of Berkeley, California, who showed up to a demonstration in the city with a Don’t Drive DOGE sign. “Tesla has become a four-wheel billboard for the immolation of our democracy.”
I do not, as a rule, take things that residents of Berkeley, California say at a protest as any kind of indicator of what average people think. Until I see otherwise, I’m just going to assume that the majority of pragmatic car buyers will just sluff off the Elon Musk thing (and some will now be more pro-Musk) and buy his cars.
Europe, though, is different. Europe has way more affordable EV options. It has Chinese automakers. It has the Renault 5 E-Tech. Also, being made up mostly of countries with parliaments, there’s a fluidity to European politics we don’t have here. The Republican Party has to serve both people like Mike Lawler and MTG, just like the Democratic Party has to encompass Ruben Gallego and AOC. If Europeans get mad at their own party, they’ll just make up a new one and we have outcomes, like in Germany, where a party can go from being a part of a governing coalition to having zero seats in a single election.
And Europeans, in large numbers, seem to be over Elon Musk. There’s a new piece in The Guardian talking about it:
For years the brand has been synonymous with Elon Musk and his stance against the climate crisis. Recently, Schwede watched aghast as the Tesla CEO poured hundreds of millions into backing Donald Trump as he made promises to ramp up domestic oil and gas production.
“He was getting more and more weird,” said Schwede, an entrepreneur and digital strategist based in Switzerland. The final straw came when Musk made back-to-back fascist-style salutes during Trump’s inauguration in January. “I felt nothing but utter disgust,” said Schwede. “And I no longer enjoyed sitting in my Tesla.”
Germany, though, is what I’m interested in. There’s a huge market there and Tesla builds cars in Germany. At the same time, Musk brought his political roadshow to Germany and supported the hard right-wing AfD party. That party did way better than usual in elections, though it only made up about 20% of the total electorate and is likely to be kept out of a governing coalition.
From that Guardian article:
For Germany’s Patrik Schneider, the turning point came as he was heckled by a stranger at a petrol station, who pointed to his Tesla and called him a Trump supporter. Saddled with a long-term lease on the vehicle, he scrambled to find a way to address his relationship with a brand that – in his mind – had soured.
“Of course, as a Tesla driver you were always the fool: the Green party voter, the world saviour, the CO2 guy,” Schneider told Germany’s Capital.de media. “But now you’re in a category that’s no longer funny.”
What he came up with was a line of “Anti-Elon stickers” for Tesla cars. In an echo of an American initiative, he began selling the stickers online six months ago, taking orders for messages that range from “I bought this before Elon went crazy” to “Elon sucks”.
A recent poll of Germany showed that adults in the country have a 71% unfavorable view of Musk, with 73% saying that Musk’s involvement in German politics is “unacceptable.”
This gets to the thing I am most curious about re: Musk and his recent shenanigans. There’s a sense of helplessness on the left, with few elections on the horizon. Tesla is an easy target as it relies on both customers and shareholders to sustain its value. What if the left’s version of the Tea Party decides to take its ire and wrath out on Tesla? In this country, at least, Tesla owners are already facing increased vandalism.
It’s super strange that the same people who claimed buying a Tesla was some kind of lefty environmental stance are now acting as if owning a Tesla is tantamount to burning the flag. These kinds of feelings, though, are hard to sustain and I’m not sure how long they’ll last here in the US. In Europe? As Eddie Izzard once joked, Europe is where the history comes from, and their memories tend to be a little longer.
Stellantis Forecasts ‘Mid-Single Digit’ Margins As Earnings Drop 102% In Second Half Of 2024
My big guess in 2024 was that Stellantis couldn’t “stick the landing” as none of its financial forecasts or product plans made any sense to me. The company had too many expensive and/or old vehicles. America, for whatever reason, felt like it was being entirely ignored.
This has been borne out by the company’s financial performance, which was absolutely dismal. Saddled with a bunch of cars that were uncompetitive, Stellantis had to lower prices and increase incentive spending. The results were a 70% year-over-year drop in profit. It gets even worse if you look at the second half of 2024, when the company went from making $8.1 billion to losing $133 million.
The Stellantis Board of Directors saw what was happening and essentially plank-walked then-CEO Carlos Tavares, not pictured, in order to try and salvage the company. This year the goal is to try and turn things around as best as they can and to get a new CEO.
Here’s what Chairman John Elkann had to say about it:
“While 2024 was a year of stark contrasts for the Company, with results falling short of our potential, we achieved important strategic milestones. Notably, we began the rollout of new multi-energy platforms and products, which continues in 2025, started production of EV batteries through our JVs, and launched the Leapmotor International partnership. Stellantis’ dedicated and talented people are driving forward with energy and determination, engaging with key stakeholders and moving decision-making closer to our customers. We are firmly focused on gaining market share and improving financial performance as 2025 progresses.”
What this means is positive revenue growth, but at the cost of continued single-digit margins, which will impact profits. If there’s a trade war and tariffs come, it’ll only get worse.
Peter Rawlinson Steps Down As Lucid CEO
Because he’s an engineer, there’s definitely been a pro-Peter Rawlinson vibe around these parts. As CEO of Lucid Motors, the former Tesla engineer managed to raise enough funding to actually build cars. And the cars are great. The best electric car you can buy in America, if price is no option, is the Lucid Air.
Also, according to Lucid, Rawlinson is no longer the CEO of the company:
“Now As we have successfully launched the Lucid Gravity, I have decided it is finally the right time for me to step aside from my roles at Lucid,” said Rawlinson. “I am incredibly proud of the accomplishments the Lucid team have achieved together through my tenure of these past twelve years. We grew from a tiny company with a big ambition, to a widely recognized technological world leader in sustainable mobility. It has been my honor to have led and grown this remarkable, truly world-class organization, because Lucid has always been first and foremost about a team effort. The time has now come for me to hand the baton to that very team.
That team, at least for the interim, is going to be led by COO Marc Winterhoff, pictured above.
Also, Lucid reported its 2024 and Q4 financials and they were pretty bad. The company delivered 10,241 vehicles and lost $3.03 billion last year. The thing people like to do here is point out that the company lost $300,000 per vehicle sold. That’s technically true. Granted, the company is rapidly trying to get its Lucid Gravity out the door, so there are a lot of costs it has to eat.
Don’t feel bad for Rawlinson. His watch is done and he’ll get to collect $120,000 a month for his role as an advisor.
Aston Martin CEO To Axe Jobs, Trim Costs To Try And Save Company
Aston Martin is a cool automaker that’s going to have to make some big changes if it wants to stick around, including cutting jobs and trimming costs as it plans to focus on squeezing more money out of each model rather than introduce a bunch of new cars.
Additionally, after many delays, the Aston Martin Valhalla is finally rolling out to customers this year.
Aston Martin plans to produce only 999 units of Valhalla, each reportedly priced at 850,000 pounds ($1.1 million), with deliveries to begin in the second half of 2025. Aston Martin declined to confirm the price.
The Valhalla is expected to help drive positive adjusted operating earnings in 2025 and free cash flow in the second half, the company said. Overall core wholesales volumes will be similar to 2024 levels, it said.
Aston Martin is not planning to launch any new models in the near future to save money on development costs, sources told Bloomberg. It will instead try to launch more derivatives of its existing models, something that Lamborghini, Porsche and Bentley have successfully done.
Maybe get Winterhoff on it?
What I’m Listening To While Writing TMD
I’ve been in a Japanese Jazz mood (J-Jazz) lately, so please enjoy the “Akashic Xronicles” from Tokyo-based Fox Capture Plan.
The Big Question
What European-market EV are you buying? Cost is no object.
Top graphic image credits: Jeep, Tesla
If the CEO of the car company I’m interested in purchasing a car from puts my elevated risk of being keyed, I’ll simply look elsewhere for my next car. I would like my car to say as little about my political affiliation as absolutely possible. I do empathize those who bought Teslas before the general brand sentiment was soured
The other day I was behind a Model 3 with an “I bought this before Elon went crazy” sticker. I do feel sorry for folks who just wanted to buy what is arguably the best EV in the US market. One of my co-workers very recently traded in his Model S for an Audi E-tron sedan to rid himself of the Musky odor.
Yeah, I’m one of those people who will absolutely never put any bumper sticker for any candidate, party, or cause on the back of my car – partly because tacky looking and paint damage, partly because I do not want to broadcast that stuff to strangers. Hell, I don’t even take those stupid “I Voted” stickers on election day
I too am a member of the ‘Nunya Movement.’
Agree, I just talked a younger neighbor out of putting up an anti Trump musk sign in his yard. I mentioned he didn’t need to advertise for trouble.
What kind of bizzaro world neighborhood do you live in? lol
There really are so many options. It’s hard to…
Ah, in that case definitely a Voiture Electronique Porquerolles:
https://live.staticflickr.com/7210/6947487953_9f0a4ca75a_b.jpg
10/10, would DD.
That’s the pure driving experience that us enthusiasts crave.
It does look fun:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDfTD2XaGcc
I’m not surprised that throwing out Nazi salutes and praising neo-Nazis isn’t popular in Europe.
If it were only the symbolism and not overt support of Nazi ideals it might not have had the same results.
Based on the support for AfD, Law and Justice, National Rally, Fidesz, Brothers of Italy, etc., there may be more of a fan base than you might expect.
I don’t think anyone is surprised. Just very much saddened.
I mean I was in the market for an EV 2 years ago and I ended up with a Cupra Born after test driving the model 3, and Elo’s weirdness then factored into that decision. I cannot image buying one now given his current actions
The Fourth Defenestration of Prague: So long Elon, out of Overton and into Vltava?
” ‘affordable Tesla’ that’s maybe a decontented Model 3 or something…”
Jokes aside, what features could be dropped from a Model 3 to make it more affordable? There is nothing more inside the cabin that could be cut given how sparse it already is.
You get 4 lawn chairs and a Cozy Coupe steering wheel.
Naw, steering wheel will be a cost-added option. The gimmick alone will add 1 million sales.
Worked for Citroen.
But they had good suspension! Basket of eggs standard and all.
They couldn’t even pull off a manual interior for the “Standard Range” Model 3 back when they had it open for preorders. Instead they software limited a SR+ Model 3 to the point that the heated seats didn’t work unless you paid several thousand to “upgrade” (unlock) to the SR+ Model 3.
Really the only place I can see them saving cost is with the battery, by cutting the size a ton.
Same car but all of the functions and features will be ad supported. You’ll have to watch a 30 second video every time you press the accelerator before the car actually moves.
Eliminate the turn signals completely. The drivers will all be using the straight-arm signal out the window.
Cost is no object… Tesla
Remove the battery, responsibly recycle it. Then crush what remains of the rest.
Rinse and repeat until cost suddenly becomes an object.
Wait, cost no object, eh?
So, an LS -swapped Tesla ran 6.07 in the quarter recently. I’m not a drag guy, but still think I could have some stupid fun with that.
OR, hear me out, any other car??? Remember, cost is no object.
So, I’m thinking buy it from Euro equivalent of CoPart after a fire.
Full tube chassis.
And, a pic of the K-hole himself from the rally inside a red circle & slash on either side.
a) troll hard
b) my family likely wouldn’t talk to me without that decor, to be honest
Um, wait: wasn’t there an article here about an electric version of the Grenadier? A lot less work and definitely more practical
I’m still against this. Any money you give, even in the 2ndary market, eventually makes it’s way back “home”. Even indirectly.
It’s the same exact reason why I am against Volvo and Polestar. While, we are forced to buy from China due to what is available for most stuff in most markets, most of that stuff is relatively low margin. Aka, a few cents on the dollar for that plastic ruler I bought my kid for school.
BUT, the margins on that Volvo or Polestar are WAY higher, and the money transferred to the Chinese government is WAY more. AND, you have a LOT more choices of cars to purchase versus the plastic ruler.
I did my best to communicate that concept, I hope it worked.
No, I get what you’re saying.
I wanted a model3 performance a year or 2 before he joked about buying Twitter, but he completely lost me that year.
I would literally buy David’s old Leaf before any Tesla
Geoff is the only answer (Britain was in the EU at the time of production). Lotus chassis, hand formed bodywork, exquisite.
And a moustache!
According to Google, the Lucid Air Dream was for sale in Europe at one point, so I’ll take one of those.
At this point, I am mostly puzzled by Elon’s actions. I assumed his foray into government was about securing contracts or having regulations changed in his favor, but he doesn’t seem to be focusing on that. I’m not even against the idea of DOGE or Elon being in government (I’ll ignore the irony of Trump ranting about the deep state while essentially appointing Elon as Secretary of Deep State), but the execution has been terrible. He appears to be indiscriminately firing people without knowing what they do. He genuinely seems incompetent.
Between his opinions and his incompetence, I’m not surprised Tesla sales have faltered. I currently own a Tesla and am conservative leaning, but even I won’t consider buying another Tesla product as long as Elon is a major part of the company. It is surprising to see a CEO intentionally alienating potential customers, but that is what he seems to be doing. I genuinely wonder what his endgame is, or if he has one at all. I’m starting to think he might be actually insane, as his actions don’t appear to be in touch with reality.
All of that is to say I’ll probably trade my Model 3 for a used Taycan at some point. So that is the European market EV I would buy.
All that ketamine is probably affecting his judgement.
“I don’t know how to afford you, but I will find you, and I will buy you.”
–Liam Neeson, Taycan
I’ve been part of the Musk hate club for a decade at this point. Nothing he does has ever made sense. The man is incapable of having a thought that lasts for more than 5 seconds. Any success has been in spite of his actions, not because of them.
Elon Musk doesn’t care about the environment, and never did. He is just very good at identifying holes in the market with which he can then exploit. EV’s are no longer a hole in the market, and he has made the money off of it, with the exception of his Delaware bonus he is waiting for.
He now has access to an even larger pool of money, our money. That is what he is now going after. Once he gets the Delaware Bonus, I bet Tesla tanks and gets sold to Nissan, LOL.
The reality is that while he’s good at hiring engineers, at the end of the day he’s simply not very smart. You really only need to listen to him speak for a few minutes before you realize the man typically has no clue what he’s talking about, and it’s been this way for years. It makes me happy to see him fail so hard with all of the world’s eyes on him. Just an absolute moron.
I wonder if hiring engineers is going to be harder for them. Being in touch with reality is generally an important trait for a competent engineer, I wonder if those people still want to work for him? There’s certainly a lot of talented very specialized people suddenly looking for work, but there’s one person they’re not about to go work for!
Do you personally know any engineers? My experience with IT, Pratt Whitney and electrical engineers has shown a distinct disconnect with any shared reality.
I know a lot of engineers (and kinda am one myself)! I’d agree it’s a very mixed group politically but (I hate generalizing and I know that’s what I’m about to do) I’d say they’re a little more intellectually curious than the average person… but also the ability to comprehend complex technical things tends to come with bigger egos and more entrenched world views. I guess I’ve mostly undermined my original point by now!
I’ve been taken to court due to a Pratt Whitney engineer and his buddys not being able to “make it work in their heads” that the repairs I did on a 320i were what fixed the problem. The Judge asked if the problem was fixed, the car owner said yes, and that was that.
The BMW 320i was never a sophisticated piece of kit and this all may have been some pranking by this guy’s co-workers. If so, that makes it even worse.
Everything Elon related has a very deserved reputation as an astoundingly toxic workplace, and these days you can’t even convince yourself that if you can survive that for a while you will cash out big.
Source: I live in Silicon Valley and have met and talked with quite a few people who did work at either Tesla or Twitter.
Agreed, and good decision on the Taycan!
Elon’s foray into government and adventure so far are related to the beliefs of some dude named Carl Yarvin. Who’s like the Budda of Northern Californians who live entirely online. And his plan of “RAGE”, or retire all government employees. And in that context is actions do make sense, which is unfortunate
Curtis Yarvin – Wikipedia
If you look into the Musk family history he is a technocrat. His grandfather was part of the Canadian Technocrat movement and he moved to South Africa from Canada when apartheid was formalized into law.
Musk does not believe in representative democracy and believes countries should be run by business elites and that wealth represents the right rule.
Why is Musk doing thing that any CEO should know will kill his company? Personally, I think Musk believes he is so rich he is untouchable – and – that there is more to be gained from direct corruption than there is to be lost from pissing off the little people. Making cars is a low margin business. Direct government contracts can be very lucrative. You can see this in Hungary where supporters of Orban became massively wealthy when government assets were sold of and privatized for pennies on the dollar or government contracts give to supporters in no-bid deals.
Just thinking of one example – Republicans have complained about federal public lands in the West for decades. Musk is right now massively cutting staff in the National Park Service, Forestry Service, and Bureau of Land Management. BLM alone manages 58 million acres of public land. Cut the federal work force, claim government is mismanaging land and that it should be privately owned, sell the land to connected individuals for pennies on the dollar. We tend to think that things like this can’t happen in the USA but the world is full of examples of this type of corruption with authoritarian rule replaces the rule of law.
Doug Burgum, the new Secretary of the Interior and former venture capitalist has directly said that US public lands are assets on the government’s balance sheet and unproductive assets should be sold.
If he truly cared about Tesla being profitable he never would’ve greenlit the Cybertruck. They could’ve built a genuinely great EV pickup, and been the first to market with it. He’s totally checked out of every one of his companies, and only cares about political authority now. I don’t know when/what will finally stop him.
Musk has flat out said he doesn’t care if the cybertruck is a sales flop because he loves that it looked like it was designed by aliens from the future. It was a pure passion project by the richest man in the world.
“I don’t care if our products flop” is not what investors should want to hear from a CEO.
Not sure if you aware the Starlink is busy with the FAA signing contracts.
https://www.wesh.com/article/faa-spacex-starlink-airspace-upgrade/63918020
The only people confused by what is currently happening are those who have spent most of their conscious existence utterly unaware of reality. The remnants of libertarian/”conservative” talking points only exist to make it easier for people to swallow fascism. They don’t actually care about the execution of those policies any more than Trump cares about the Bible.
There are some fundamental facts to understand about Musk:
1- He is extremely stupid. I am willing to believe he was smart at one point, maybe back in 2010 when his sense of humor formed. But right now, after a decade of believing his own hype and taking a profound amount of drugs, he is incredibly stupid.
2- He still believes he is smarter than everyone else, and that he should be in charge of everything in the world as a result. He ignores experts and fires anyone who disagrees with him. Running wild through government systems is him believing that he can do government better.
3- He is a huge fan of apartheid.
I don’t think we need to overthink this at all.
Guy is wilding out and if it were anyone else there would have been an intervention. Alas, he has no friends and the authorities find him either too rich or too convenient to bother.
That is probably as good an explanation as any. It seems like Musk is enjoying this. He reminds me of a kid using a magnifying glass to burn ants. I think he just likes to cause chaos and harm. It is disturbing someone like him has any role in government, much less this big of one.
He reminds me of a kid who eats his boogers, but keeps doing it because he things everyone likes him for doing it, when they don’t, they are just laughing at him.
You:
also you:
Pick a lane.
That’s solidly funny.
Incompetence is the number one quality Trump looks for. Write it across the top of your resume (just don’t spell it right) and you could land a gig running a multi-billion dollar department.
The term ‘useful idiot’ comes to mind.
So does “idiot savant”, with emphasis on the idiot.
Not “hard right” but far-right. Maggie Thatcher was “hard-right”, while the BNP (nazi supporters) is a far-right party.
Similarly Sarkozy in France was a “hard-right” president (at times) while Marine Le Pen (father joked about jews and ovens while she looked on) is far-right although she is desperately trying to scramble left.
By giving Nazi salutes, Musk has moved to far-right.
If you buy anything from his companies you are now associated with the far-right. And in Europe far-right are in a minority, even in Italy where a formerly far-right politician (Mussolini supporter) softened to hard-right and became prime minister.
For the record, NOBODY bought a Tesla before Musk went crazy. They just bought a Tesla before he showed his true colors to the world.
My thoughts exactly when I saw that sticker! He has been a snake-oil salesman his entire life but has somehow managed to con much of the world. I was interested in the original Model S until it debuted, when the sales process was all smoke and mirrors.
Musk is already known to be pretty bored of running a car company, and his duties as Supreme Chancellor of the United States do seem to be taking up the majority of his time now, to say nothing of the conflict of interest that comes from a Head of Government serving simultaneously as CEO of a publicly traded company. Maybe it would be a good time for him to step down and hand Tesla over to someone else, he can spin the motivation anyway he wants, play it off as a positive for himself
“It’s also just one month. Tesla can lower prices.”
I’m not sure lower prices will help that much given a growing number of people who are of the mind “no Tesla at any price” or “No Tesla unless Elon Musk is out of the company and severed all ties including selling off his stake”
The second one is basically the camp I’m in. And I’ve also sold off my direct and indirect Tesla holdings (mutual funds).
“What European-market EV are you buying? Cost is no object.”
Mercedes EQS. I think the design is quite nice and I like that it’s a large hatchback.
Ami!
You lie down with Nazis, you get a freeze.
Cost no object Euro EV? the Alpine A290
I’d go Por-shuh for an EV, if cost is no object.
I saw a Cybertruck while driving yesterday and actually sneered in disgust.
I tend to furrow my brow and recoil with a mixture of disgust and confusion when I see one.
I have the urge to Nazi salute every Tesla I’ve seen since inauguration day. I don’t, because I’m not a Nazi. And because most of the owners were duped or ignorant of what and who they were supporting. Anyone in a Cybertruck or buying a new one though? They know.
Give them a thumbs down. It’s the new “Let’s go Brandon”
Nothing wrong with a classic flipped bird, either.
I prefer the English middle finger, as it confuses most of my fellow Americans.
I think old style, okay, they were the EVs at the time.
Facelift Model 3? Bit of a side-eye, but there is some plausible deniability. Suspicious though.
Cybertruck or facelift Model Y? Nope, get out. Mask was fully off at that point.
Laughing hilariously while pointing at the incEl Camino’s driver works for me.
It struck me yesterday, when I saw a cyberfuck picking up kids at an elementary school, that this vehicle is the equivalent of walking around with your fly open and your dick hanging out of your pants. It seemed out of place, pompous and embarrased simultaneously.
One of my 9-year-old daughter’s friend’s parents have a Cybertruck. They are rich, but otherwise normal, lefty people. They bought it before Musk went nuts. I feel embarrassed for them, and I drop my kid off in a rusty, 4-cylinder BMW e36.
No, they didn’t. The Cybertruck is example 400 of Musk being out of his gourd.
The man was already deeply entrenched in the transphobe camp when the CT came out. He’s been nuts since long before he did the Nazi thing.
My mom typically sees a Cybertruck at least once during her morning walks. She says the driver always returns her wave; I’ve wondered if that’s the only friendly interaction the driver encounters when they’re behind the wheel.
I feel for Cybertruck buyers who got in when it was easier to disregard the guy’s toxicity… it’s not my cup of tea but I get the urge for something that looks like nothing else on the road. Anyone who buys one now though knows what they’re supporting…
Does the driver wave quite firmly with their right arm completely straight?
If you’re into Japanese Jazz you absolutely need to give Casiopea a listen. They’re a real favorite of mine. Mint Jams is worth several front to back listens and it’s mind blowing that it’s a live record. Most jazz musicians are tight and super technical but Casiopea is on another level…on top of that here’s a fun fact about them that I know this crowd will appreciate: their original keyboardist composes music for train stations!
Anyway, Musk is a giant fascist douchebag and aligning himself with the far right was always going to come with consequences for Tesla. Their primary customer for their entire existence has been well to do people who are environmentally conscious. No shit those people won’t want to buy your products when you’re proudly standing behind someone who wants to completely gut all environmental regulations and has draconian social views. Those also don’t align well with the average yuppie environmentalist…
I think Tesla is legitimately going to be in some trouble. While the Cult Of Elon is still very much a thing I genuinely don’t think that the average terminally online far right whacko either wants an EV or can afford a Tesla. As has been the case for years Tesla would do well to kick Musk to the curb but that’ll never happen…so I’ll continue pointing and laughing at every Cybertruck I see.
Apparently a lot of the owners of those things are really mad that their rolling codpieces that they bought for attention are attracting negative attention. That’s too bad. Beggars can’t be choosers and main character syndrome comes with drawbacks. Honestly I think we should all try to blast Chief Keef while pointing and laughing if we can for added effect. HAW HAW HAW! HAW HAW HAW!
Viz. Japanese jazz, I can warmly recommend Soil and Pimp Sessions, they are fucking blow your socks off great.
Pissing off core customers is a surefire way to crater sales. Stellantis and Musk both managed to do that. Stellantis by taking away the V8’s and Musk by publicly tying himself to a divisive politician while doing unpopular things. Stellantis at least has cooler heads that can admit mistakes. Musk, nah, he’s going to kill Tesla unless their board copies Stellantis to give him the boot.
Tesla needing to copy Stellantis’s homework? Didn’t have that on my 2025 bingo card.
Every single topic in this article just makes me think of all the peons who are going to lose their jobs as their companies continue to decay. And the people in charge will not suffer any consequences. It’s a real bummer.
This is something that doesn’t get talked about as much. There are 120,000 Tesla employees. All doing what the rest of us with jobs do: Try and do our best, avoid getting laid off and save enough to maybe retire someday.
I cannot see Tesla surviving much longer. Elon has poisoned the brand so badly that even if he were to step down the damage is now done. These people will lose their jobs. Not because they did anything wrong. It was they- not Elon- who designed, engineered and later built the cars. So now its THEY who have to pay for their boss running his fucking mouth. Pathetic. Sad.
That’s capitalism, baby.
Story is always the same….company crashes, workers get the boot/screwed, owners come out fine and move on.
Signed: Been down this road many times in manufacturing.
The only way the brand can be saved is the board steps up and gets Elon to leave and sell off his stake… or they force him out.
Forcing him out would actually be a better look for the company.
Should have done it a year or so ago….
They should have. But instead they doubled down and fought in court to give him the biggest single payday in human history.
This, Elon will hand around long enough to get that paycheck from Delaware then bounce the fuck out.
Tesla reincorporated in Texas last year, Musk had a falling out with the Delaware chancery court and took his ball home with him
He is still trying to get his $45bil bonus in court.
One issue they have is that the primary reason their stock price is so inflated is Musk’s cult of personality and willingness to lie about future product development. If they kick him out, the stock price comes down to earth, killing the company in a different way.
At this point, even if you buy into Tesla’s autonomous cars and robot crap, what good would any innovation be if the brand is too toxic to get anyone on board with it? Hard to achieve infinite growth when your potential market is dropping faster than the CEO can fire federal employees.
German outrage a little late to the party.
Tesla is toast. The Venn Diagram of people that buy BEVs and people that are far right politically is….Elon Musk.
I mean. Cybertruck owners didn’t let a BEV powertrain get in their way.
ThereAreDozensOfUs.gif
I dunno… I saw a brand-new Toyota bZ4X with MAGA and Trump stickers all over the back. Not sure if it was some kind of ironic joke, but a BEV assembled in Japan doesn’t strike me as a MAGAwagon, yet here we are.
You’re making the mistake of thinking that MAGA supporters understand global trade.
You didn’t need the last two words to speak truth.
Are you sure they didn’t mean Manga? That might explain the styling.
I wish. There are so many Teslas down here in “Trumpistan” (SW Florida) at this point that the BEV aspect is very much secondary to “owning the libs” somehow. Maybe we need to start a false flag rumor that “the libs” actually hate wind farms and solar power. After all, Sleepy Joe does have a Corvette…
And had an ATS-V in between the vice presidency and the presidency
Also, Obama drove a 300C until he was pressured into trading it for something more economical friendly during the 2008 campaign
I wish we’d get a new 300 with the straight 6 on the new Charger platform….a man can dream
The previous 300 and Charger shared a platform so why not? Give the Charger a nice classy exterior and slap in some more luxurious trappings. Hell, give it that button-tufted velour stuff and optional opera lights. It’s time to pull out all the stops.
Rich Corinthian leather.
Yeah, I still think there’s room in the market for both Chrysler and Dodge versions of most platforms. Give the Chrysler a bit more elegant styling and a somewhat nicer interior, maybe make it a sedan to create some differentiation from the Charger hatchback
A clean 300 luxury sedan off the new charger platform would be excellent!
It is wild to think it wasn’t that long ago that people who could afford much more expensive cars were actively choosing to buy a Chrysler 300C.
Then they fucked up by going conservative with the 2nd generation so it wasn’t as impactful as the first one, left it on the market too long without meaningful updates, and basically stopped marketing it
Are you referring to MoonPieTown?
https://www.local3news.com/local-news/moonpie-satirically-renames-florida-to-moonpietown/article_f5bb4dc0-e956-11ef-b062-1fca1842cad6.html
I’m 100% okay with this!
I am liberal as they come, and I used to support wind energy. Until I visited a wind farm. The windmills are loud. WOOSH WOOSH WOOSH WOOSH. ALL THE TIME. Non stop. Always. I was only there for about 30 minutes and the WOOSH WOOSH was unbearable. The ocean based wind farms must drive the wales crazy. .
“he windmills are loud. WOOSH WOOSH WOOSH WOOSH.”
Yup… even small windmills are noisy. In my view, the best places to put windmills is around major highways… areas that are already noisy to begin with.
Small windmills do not have to be noisy if they are expensive. SkyWind NG in Germany makes one that is rated for 34 dB at 25m away in 10m/s wind. Price is $3k for a 1kW system plus the cost of the tower.
I was gonna write something close, but you beat me to it. This is what the (sorry for the insult) obtuse people on this site think, that a Tesla is a sign/statement of something.
People down here are firmly in the belief that Trump’s ideas (concentrate on the ideas part) are the correct ones.
After living here for as long as I have, listening to the sometimes irrational (but often rational arguments to the point), I can’t say I disagree with it all. Some of it is bullet point correct.
That said, as far as driving a Tesla goes. It just makes a shit ton of sense in Florida, if you have the space/charger/solar roof. I don’t think there is anything deeper to it. That’s also why I see a ton of Hyundai and all the fancier ones, too.
Some folks on here (not all) like to think that cars are extensions of their morality. These old folks in Florida don’t give a fuck about that. lol. They just want a good deal on a car that gets them to Publix and still lets them feel connected to a world they retired from. The whole Buscemi with a skateboard thing, and it’s adorable. The older I get, the more I get it. Upside down pineapples or not, ha
Since what is “far” right is obscenely subjective I’ll leave my 2 cents as a right leaning person who likes BEVs.
People on the Right really don’t like being forced into doing anything, whether it’s buying a BEV, giving up their guns, etc. However if you make a quality BEV and people have the option to buy it or not they very well may buy one. I think BEVs will win on the market overall, without mandates, it just takes time, not saying the free market is without its faults or that it caters to every preference, but it does maximize the options.
Considering all the recent Tesla hate ponder this: Imagine Trump had a US BEV mandate, and Tesla was the standard for the amount of American parts necessary to be legal to sell in the US. Now you have to buy a Tesla if you want a new car, and eventually they’ll ban old cars from the roads once Telsas are the only new car sold. Would you support that EV mandate?
Likely not because you don’t like Elon and therefore don’t like Tesla.
I wish I could have bought a BEV I want in the US (Like the Ox Truck for example), however the BEVs I want are either not sold in the US, not sold in the configuration I want in the US (like a long Bed extended cab F-150 Lightning with the front 3 seat layout), or were never made even if production ready (Original Jeep Magneto concept).
Instead I went with a 24 Jeep Wrangler Sport 2 Door V6 5MT that sadly gets 17 MPG City 23 MPG Highway. Hell, if I could of I would have likely bought a Wrangler 4XE if they made it in a 2 door variant, as shit as the 4XE is, and used it in BEV mode 99% of the time. However the Jeep was really the last new car I saw myself actually wanting to buy, even excluding the powerplant. If I’m going with a pure ICE vehicle I’m going with a manual transmission, but if Jeep made a Wrangler 2 Door Hybrid with an e-CVT I likely would have bought that instead as it would probably get 30 MPG Highway minimum. I bought the Jeep mostly for the mechanical features, small size/tight turning radius, 4WD and the ability to add mechanical LSDs/locking diffs, and the straight axles were just a bonus for me.
Whether it was a BEV, a hybrid, a PHEV, a range extended BEV, etc. I could give a flying fuck. I just wanted it to be small-ish, turn tight, have 4 driven wheels + a mechanical LSD and or locker options, and have a mechanical interior (hand crank windows, manual steering wheel adjustments, manual seats, etc.)
Even today most BEVs are unnecessarily technophilic (all our door handles have to be electric IF we even offer door handles! etc.) and still fairly limited in overall capability compared to all the ICE offerings on the market.
Personally I’m unlikely to ever buy a Tesla due to previous interactions and their design standards, so I certainly wouldn’t like a BEV mandate, Tesla exclusively or not.
Also forgot to mention this is why the e-Golf was so popular and remained so popular even after the introduction of the ID.3 (it’s replacement).
It was a Golf, which is a quality automobile, that happened to be electric. It didn’t have electric door handles, a massive touchscreen, etc. it was just a great car that happened to be electric.
“It was a Golf, which is a quality automobile, “
A quality automobile? LOL… you’re funny… “German Quality”… uh huh…
To be clear, Nazi salutes at political rallies and vocal support for Germany’s AfD party is far right. If you disagree, I don’t know what you would put to the right of that.
Google image search X politician name and Nazi Salute, Most politicans at one point or another have had an arm outstretched at above a 90 degree angle with a flat palm, insodoing resembling a Nazi Salute.
AfD is Far right on some issues, moderate on others.
And seemingly you missed the rest of my comment in its entirety.
The TLDR being BEVs are not political until you make them political. Mandates made them political, and in general the average right leaning person is against mandates. Without Mandates they’re just one of many drivetrain options, with advantages and disadvantages unique to it just like every other drivetrain option out there.
I assume Nazis still wipe their ass, eat potato chips, drink water, the works.
TP, Potato chips, Water, etc. don’t have to be political, neither do BEVs.
Oof. Just so you know, when you’re saying “the nazis made some good points also though”, you might be far right.
I mean the Nazis had socialized healthcare, and so do tons of European countries and Canada. They also liked Beer, Bratwurst, VW, Mercedes, BMW, etc.
You think the AfD are Nazis, and that everything Nazis do is bad, and everything they like is bad, even when they like the same things that you like, and do the same things that you do….
See the problem with that logic?
Yes, I’m the one exhibiting a huge glaring blind spot. Do go on…
A freeze frame of a video of waving is not the same as what we witnessed Elon (or Steve Bannon recently, or many others) doing, a hand on the heart directly to a stiff, pointed right arm outstretched with palm down and fingers closed. Most politicians also outright decry fascist rhetoric and show disdain for Neo-Nazi figures, which cannot be said for Musk. Context, both for the motion in question, and the background and beliefs of the person in question, deeply matter.
I think a few people are having a hard time accepting the reality of where we are. Especially those who helped get us here.
Yep, and I don’t intend to insult or demean anyone who enters into a good-faith conversation on the topic. I’ve mentioned this in a past TMD, but even the Anti-Defamation League has lost credibility on the matter after research shows that the CEO of the ADL is a hardcore Musk fanboy, and members of the ADL have resigned in protest for said CEO’s outright support of Elon. I say this all to agree, we’re in a messy, scary time, where the fascist rhetoric of the Nazi’s is gaining legitimate traction and is being openly peddled by those in power across the world. I believe the vast, vast majority of the world does not want this, but they refuse to see it for what it is because it’s an inconvenient truth, the same way in which people still refuse to accept the way the climate is changing due to mankind’s actions. It’s not what we want, and it’s a lot easier to ignore than face.
Fine. Then go to Youtube, type in the search bar X politician name and Nazi Salute, and watch the videos. Same shit, now in video form.
Fingers closed? Nazi salutes aren’t done with a fist, that’s like half a half assed Hail Hydra dual salute.
Fingers closed as in side by side, not spread like a typical wave, and in this case, not like a clenched fist like you may think I meant. I don’t mean to be argumentative here, but saying “look up *person of choice* Nazi salute” does not remedy the actions that Elon has and is taking, and the fact that my point stands on the mature of his character and the neo-nazi groups he publicly sympathizes with, and the fascist rhetoric he lives behind.
Ah, yeah, I get what you meant biomechanics wise now.
Great, attack Elon based upon his actions, and stated support for specific things that you consider to be bad.
Not a gesture that probably everyone has done unintentionally at one point or another because it’s in our range of movement. I’ve probably done who knows how many salutes of various groups left right and center just by moving my body. Churchill thought he was doing the peace sign, ended up meaning something entirely different.
Forgive me for not putting much weight in hand gestures, I personally lived through 4chan gaslighting major anti-discrimination organizations in believing the okay hand symbol secretly means White Power, brought to you by the same people who started the “Free Bleeding” campaign.
I dispute your claim that I’ve ever done a Nazi salute because I know what it means and specifically avoid it. This isn’t something normal people do in their daily life. Much like I’ve never called anyone the N-word “by accident”. Some things are taboo for a reason.
The idea that Musk “didn’t mean it that way” when he TWICE did a Nazi salute on stage is indicative of either massive ignorance or massive incompetence on his part. Or, more likely, massive denial about what’s going on politically right now.
So you’ve never raised one of your arms fully outstretched with a flat palm fingers outstretched at above a 90° angle EVER, not for a single second?
I call bullshit.
This is impressive. You really, truly, and for-real are trying to argue that Musk didn’t intentionally perform a nazi salute at a political rally? He was just swatting at a fly or something?
I’ve rehabbed shoulder injuries, so yes, my arm has been in that position.
What I have not ever done is put my hand over my heart first and then directly moved it to that position because it’s a Nazi salute and I’m not a Nazi. It’s really not that much of a stretch for me to say I haven’t done it.