Have you ever driven a car with a low, dash-mounted internal rear-view mirror? You know the kind I mean, where the inside rear-view mirror is mounted low, on the top of the dashboard, as opposed to hanging from above the windshield on a little arm, or, as was common until quite recently when all sorts of cameras and sensors began to be shoved behind rear-view mirrors, stuck to the glass with adhesive? Adhesive that would invariably fail in the heat and drop your mirror to the floor like a de-candified piñata? I’m talking about the other kind.
The low-mounted inside rear-view mirror is one of those things that is almost extinct now, but is also one of those things that I wonder if they perhaps never got a fair shake. It’s so hard to judge them because we’re all so trained and have developed optic muscle memories to instinctively look up for a rear-view mirror, but let’s just take a moment to consider these.
I’ve driven a good number of cars with the dash-mounted mirror, and even owned a car that had one, my old Volvo 1800S. The dash was the same as the one you see in the top shot of this article, and was really a beautiful dashboard, and remains one of my favorites. Part of its charm was the rear-view mirror, perched there right in the middle of the dash.
When I first got the car, the plan was to share it with my then-girlfriend, though she insisted that I also install a second rear-view mirror in the conventional location. I procrastinated doing that long enough for her to decide the car was too much of an ass-pain to drive, so she returned to her modern Civic and I started driving the 1800S regularly, and found that I adapted to the low mirror pretty quickly.
It seems counterintuitive, but the view from that mirror was quite good! The field of view out the back window wasn’t appreciably different that high-mounted mirrors, at least not in any appreciable way I could tell. So why did this not catch on?
I mean, some cars used them – a bunch of 1950s American cars had this setup, along with legends like the Citroën DS:
The low mirror seemed to be more likely to appear on sports cars, like, say, an MGA:
…or even a Shelby Cobra:
For these cars, the issues usually had more to do with the weird sizes and shapes of the mirror. For the MGA and lots of other British sports cars of the era, the rear-view mirror was so small and dainty as to almost make no sense. Nobody was slipping these in their breast pockets when they parked, so why did they have to be so tiny?
And on that Cobra, I couldn’t figure out why it was round; a wide mirror gives you a much more panoramic view of what you just whizzed by. That round one was more like a backwards-facing periscope. But I guess what’s behind you is the past, and who gives a damn about that?
Significantly, these low dash-mounted mirrors seem popular in the bear community and their natural environments, Studebakers:
I’m curious if any of you have ever owned a car with such a mirror, and, if so, what you think. I say “owned” instead of “driven” because I think you need some time to re-train your eyes where to look, since we’re all so used to high rear-view mirrors, and I think that you need to get past that instinct before you can make a fair comparison.
It’s been years since I drove my 1800S regularly, so I barely remember the rear-view-sperience, but I do remember it not being a big deal after a while. I think when I switched between cars there was a moment of adaption, but once your brain writes the low-mirror software, you can switch back and forth pretty easily.
They kinda look cooler, too? Anyway, I want to know what you think, because you’re what matters here!
My 62 Austin Healey Sprite has a dash mounted mirror. It works fine. It is a bit low with the top on as I have to adjust the mirror up a bit to see out of the top rear window.
The high-mounted RVM on my 2017 Honda Accord is almost perfectly suited to the rear window. I can’t imagine one mounted on the dash would give me as good of a view of what’s going on behind me. And I appreciate that it somehow dims itself at night when there’s someone behind me in a tall F-250 with very bright headlights. And I also appreciate the passenger side wing mirror has a built-in camera that switches on and shows up on a dash screen and I don’t have to crane my neck around past the mirror and over my right shoulder to make sure there’s nobody where I might want to move into. Even more so after having a couple of neck vertebrae fused. It kind of makes me sad that Honda dropped that feature on newer models. But at 67 years old and only 61K miles on that car, probably not something I need to lose any sleep over.
Most of the motorcycles I’ve owned had pretty ineffective RVMs, showing my shoulders, but not what I really wanted to see behind me, especially while wearing a coat with armored shoulder pads. You learn, you adjust and lean one way and then the other to scan. Like clearing (small) turns in a Cessna as I was instructed to do while getting my pilot training, so many years ago. Bank one way and lift the wing up and scan, and then do the other.
So far, that has all worked well, since I’m still on the planet.
Outside of a two seater, a dash mounted RWM is useless nowadays. Very limited effectivity with most modern vehicles. Even the rear headrests block part of the view.
MG Midget with the mirror mounted on the center rod. I kept it really low so I could look over it. Drove it that way for years
I would like to have a dash-mounted mirror in my Alfa 2000GT, with the high mount one I have issues with rear view because the roof curves down ahead of the rear glass.
I have a on-dash rear-view mirror on my car now, only in its on a screen. It works pretty good I guess.
My daily driver is a 2000 BMW Z3, a car with an objectively terrible rear view mirror placement that severely obstructs your right hand field of view. I found myself constantly having to bob and lean to make sure that cars merging on freeways, cars on my right at four way stops, and even pedestrians at crosswalks weren’t hidden behind the rear view mirror. The solution for me was to create a dash mounted rear view mirror using an aftermarket auto dimming mirror and a mount that I designed and 3D printed. That was a mod that I created five years ago, and still I couldn’t be happier with the solution. The mirror looks factory installed and fits with the overall roadster aesthetic, and my rear view is virtually identical to what it was before but without the annoyance and danger of having my right hand forward view blocked in any way. Adjusting to the mirror placement on the dash was almost instant and feels completely natural. Two thumbs up.
I think low mirrors lost in larger cars with a back seat, the passenger sitting in the middle rear would block the view. Once high mirrors became common large and small cars followed suit
Because, many Cobra’s raced without a full windshield, and would use the “Bullet” style rearview mirror for aerodynamics. If it was a standard flat mirror the wind would be constantly pushing it downward.
It occurs to me that dash top mirrors won’t work with modern vehicles because the belt line is so high the mirror would show the inside of crossover’s hatch instead of a rear window.
Regarding cameras, Japanese vans have a mirror on the tailgate that serves the same function without electronics
As a proud member of the LGBTQIA+ community, “In the bear community” really made me do a double take. And giggle.
I didn’t get it, what is the reference?
Bears are a type of gay man. They’re usually larger in stature, have body hair, and a beard (not required though). Think a big scruffy gay in flannel or leather lol.
Ah, I get it. Sort of like a bear-hug then?
Bear with me please..
I don’t see it mentioned yet, so here’s another: The 1970’s Lotus Elite had a dash-mounted rearview, largely because a mirror mounted in the traditional location would have a view full of headliner due to the car’s downward sloping and very long (shooting brake) roof. Mounting the mirror on the dash gives a straight site-line over the rear seats and through the rear windows (there’s two rear windows – one separates humans from the fuel tank in the trunk and the other is the rear hatch). Here’s mine:
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51839634559_e831b37a32_b.jpg
for size comparison:
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51839665594_8955969146_b.jpg
… which shows that the Elite is super low and that it has a downward sloping roof, whereas the Z3 has a fairly flat roof (and a mirror mounted in the traditional location)
Interestingly, the Elite’s brother, “Eclat” ditched the shooting brake roof line in favor of a more traditional fastback rear end with a highly raked rear window that starts much further forward; which removed the need for a low mounted mirror. Eclat has its mirror in the standard location, but aside from the roof line and mirror location, is otherwise largely the same car.
I found that it took all of about 10 minutes of driving to get used to the dash-mounted mirror. Switching back and forth between cars is a non-issue. A much bigger “get used to it” issue on this car is that the blinker stalk is on the wrong side of the steering wheel… which is maddeningly difficult to remember.
Yes, it’s the same mirror that was used in a bunch of British tat but stuck upside down. Mine has fallen off, once I’ve retrimmed the dash I’ll have to stick it back on.
I have a LHD ’78 Elite, my blinker stalk is on the normal side of the steering wheel. I wonder if Lotus switched that at some point in production?
As for mirrors, I find the side mirrors more problematic than the low mounted rear view. My driver’s side mirror slowly droops to a position just slightly lower than useful, and I’ve never been able to get the passenger mirror to show me anything remotely useful.
Me? I see them as a glamour piece.
Some of my earliest memories are sitting in the back seat of a late-fifties MoPar with our well coifed, beautifully dressed family friend wheeling around: one hand on the wheel, the other hand, manicured, punctuating the air with her long, smokey, lady cigarette.
She was always droll, and showered us with bounteous love and attention (and candy).
And of course, that mirror was planted right in the middle of the dash. And when they moved the mirrors, that’s when the world changed.
[From the 4-year-old in the back. Unbelted of course]
My family’s Saabs (93A, 95, not sure about the 96) had dash-mounted rear view mirrors. I learned to drive in one of them, seemed perfectly normal to me, it was the pull-chain radiator window shade and the fact that the starter control was a T-handled cable that seemed a bit unusual.
I’ll take any way of securing a rear view mirror to a car over gluing it to the windshield.
Glue sucks.
Agreed. The mirror in my 1976 Volvo 66 GL fell off the windshield a few years ago, which drew my attention to the corresponding mirror in my 1975 parts car, as it was instead screwed in place above the windshield. Careful examination of what was hidden above the headliner in the ’76 confirmed my suspicion that the necessary bracket, already drilled and tapped appropriately, was indeed still there despite having been rendered superfluous with the change in model year. It is now no longer superfluous and my parts car no longer has a mirror.
I had the exact same experience with my 1988 Nissan 200SX. The original mirror was mounted to a metal “foot” glued to the windshield. When I wanted to replace the mirror, some kind soul on the old Club S12 forum advised me to remove the map light housing and look behind it. There I found the exact mounting point for the ceiling-mounted mirror used on later 240SX’s. In fact, the same mirror from nearly any Nissan from 1986 to around 1998 will mount right up. I have never figured out why the mirror was initially glued on.
Actually, it sticks.
🙂
Till it don’t 🙁
Indeed.
I seem to remember one of my cars in the past mounting the mirror to the headliner. My current car’s mirror is mounted to the big sensor module in my windshield, which just means the module is now held on with adhesive instead.
Same shit, different design, I guess?
Now that there are manufacturers seriously proposing having no rear windows, and lets be honest, many with rear windows have useless visibility anyway, cameras will be taking over. I could see the introduction of a back-up screen that is always on, not just when in reverse. I’m pretty sure the juvenile stylists we have these days would love an excuse to stick another tablet awkwardly on the dash. It would look soooo techie!
Incidentally, I still haven’t experienced a backup camera worth the trouble. They all seem like crap, probably becasue they are only there to meet regulations. Nothing beats the old over the shoulder. Unless of course you have no rear window or bad visibility.
The one issue I have with screen instead of mirrors is I can see stuff in a mirror, with my aged ways I need my reading glasses to see stuff in a backup monitor in lieu of rear view mirror.
My dad has a newer Corvette where you can do either or, and I can’t use the camera/monitor without glasses but can use the just mirror just fine.
That’s not the only issue. Next time you’re driving, pay attention to how often you unconsciously move your head around while looking in your mirrors to get extra field of view. Your brain does this automatically as if you were looking out a window. A screen completely removes this ability.
That would drive me bonkers I think if more move to the monitors for side mirrors that they keep trying to make happen. But yea, it is an issue with the center mirror for sure.
The aftermarket head unit on my Prius has an option to show the rear camera view at any time. I use that when driving with it packed up to the point that the mirror is no longer useful.
The camera’s fisheye view is actually pretty damn good with blind spots on the highway.
Although I’m still trying to get in contact with Pioneer to get them to remove the “IMAGE MAY BE REVERSED” warning, which should be a prompt rather than always-on.
These were common on Chrysler Corp. products from the late ’50s into early ’60s. I didn’t own it or drive it but my parents had a 1958 Plymouth Belvedere with the dash mounted mirror. My dad hated the car and complained about almost everything about it but I don’t recall he ever said anything about the mirror.
My ’62 MG Midget (first car I ever owned) had a dash-mounted rear-view mirror, as did my father’s 1960 Chrysler (car in which I took my first driver’s license test). But I am an Old, so that’s to be expected.
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