The new hybrid Honda Prelude is officially coming next year, and it has people intrigued. Honda will once again have a sporty liftback coupe on sale in America, and it’ll feature both the practicality of rear seats and the efficiency of a hybrid powertrain. The initial North American press release didn’t feature a ton of details on the powertrain, but thanks to Japanese press releases and prototype media drives, we now know a little bit more about Honda’s new coupe.
When it comes to what makes it go, specs are scarce, but you’ll find a new two-liter naturally aspirated Atkinson-cycle four-cylinder engine, a more efficient front drive unit, lower production costs, and paddle shifters that aren’t just for dialing in regenerative braking. You know what isn’t present here? A CVT transmission. No automatic, either. So what’s Honda doing here?
Like other modern Honda hybrids, the Prelude doesn’t actually have a transmission. Instead, when engine power is needed to drive the wheels, the engine is clutched directly to the wheels through a fixed ratio – no CVT, nothing continuously varying here. As such, you end up with three basic modes of powertrain operation: Electric power alone from banked energy in the battery pack; engine power driving a generator and flowing that power to the drive motor; and engine power driving the wheels directly. It’s a wonderfully simple system, but it begs the question: How do you get “gears” in a car without a transmission as such?
Well, in a battery-electric vehicle, it’s all software. A series of motor response curves are tuned, each pull of a paddle briefly interrupts drive torque, and fake engine sounds fill in the soundtrack. There’s a bit of that going on in the Prelude as well. The simulated eight-speed transmission in the new Prelude is entirely virtual, and there is some fake engine noise to pad the driver’s ears, but there’s also real engine noise beneath it. This is where things really get interesting.
See, this “S+ Shift” mode, as Honda calls it, actually varies the RPM of the gasoline engine under the hood to both provide more immediate response when exiting corners and offer a greater sense of immersion. As Honda puts it, the logic of holding revs off-throttle rather than, say, shutting off the gasoline engine, “greatly improves the initial response time of the motor when the driver depresses the accelerator pedal.” Indeed, Japanese automotive media outlet CarGraphic has captured video behind the wheel of a Prelude prototype, and the results sound shockingly good. It sounds like a pointed four-cylinder engine in Honda tradition, because to an extent, that’s what’s happening.
It’s also worth noting that the simulated shifts sound pretty damn prompt, quicker than the mushy trombone slide of a CVT switching between stepped ratios. Weirdly, rolling into S+ Shift mode almost sounds like a torque converter coming up to stall speed, an odd sensation when you consider this hybrid system has no torque converter, but one that makes sense when you realize the gasoline engine is likely coming up to speed against the forces of a generator. Simulated downshifts also seem as quick as some of the best automatics on the market today, meaning this drive mode has the promise to be more joyful than frustrating.
Of course, there’s more to the new Prelude than fake shifts. From this Ride Now video, we can glean that the Prelude uses dual-axis struts from the Civic Type R, adaptive dampers, and enormous fixed front brake calipers. The track’s been widened and the wheelbase has been shortened, both good things when it comes to promising a certain fun factor. Interestingly enough, Ride Now claims the standard drive mode is dubbed “GT” for grand touring, potentially an indicator of the Prelude’s natural disposition. However, in sportier drive modes, the ride does seem to firm up nicely judging by body movements.
Needless to say, we can’t wait for an opportunity to get behind the wheel of the new Prelude next year and experience these simulated shifts ourselves. Sure, they might be mimicry rather than authenticity, but in an age when almost every combustion-powered performance car features fake engine noise, manual transmissions are saddled with clutch delay valves, and electronic throttle curves usually aren’t linear, who’s to say what’s real and fake anymore? A good time is a good time, and we’re curious to see if the Prelude provides.
Story photo credits: Honda
Top graphic image credits: Honda; Cars And Bids
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“Like other modern Honda hybrids, the Prelude doesn’t actually have a transmission.”
Really? No transmission?
It’s got a single speed transmission. It doesn’t just stop existing if it doesn’t have multiple gears. Something has to transmit the torque, it’s not done via Bluetooth. It’s gears, in a box, with a single ratio.
“ See, this “S+ Shift” mode, as Honda calls it, actually varies the RPM of the gasoline engine under the hood to both provide more immediate response when exiting corners and offer a greater sense of immersion.“
So how do you vary the engine revs if you have a single fixed gear ratio? You either have to vary vehicle speed or slip the clutch. It’s the only way. Unless they aren’t really varying the engine revs.
“The track’s been widened and the wheelbase has been shortened…”
From what? The 2001 Prelude?
From the Type R its based on?
we can glean that the Prelude uses dual-axis struts from the Civic Type R, adaptive dampers, and enormous fixed front brake calipers. The track’s been widened and the wheelbase has been shortened,
Between the unconventional transmission, the S+ button, and those engine sounds, this feels a lot more more like a fresh attempt at the CR-Z than a Prelude.
As an owner of a CR-Z, I’m into it, but I’m not sure it’ll mean success for the model given what happened last time they did a hybrid coupe.
Also, the track was widened and the wheelbase shortened… compared to what? I assume this is just a Hybrid Civic with a different body
I couldn’t hear nearly anything over the constant yapping.
The biggest thing people love in a little fwd Honda coupe is not being able to tune the engine and not actually being able to shift. I give it 5 years before this is the only transmission in the type r.
I don’t understand. I have never understood simulated shifts. To me, the reason I like a manual is for the control and response. I want to feel like the input I am providing is doing something, not asking the computer to do something. This summer I ended up buying a Bolt EV, and when I push the pedal, it reacts the same amount every time. It is not the most engaging car to drive but was my favorite for my budget.
okay…. new rant: How much of car design is just about making a first impression during the test drive to get someone to buy the car? I was thinking about that reading the article about “instrument clusters” Even if this mode is truly useless, but it is kinda fun and makes someone smile during a test drive and they buy the car – did the feature do its job?
Back in the day, GM was famous for a very aggressive tip-in for the throttle. You just touched it and the car, no matter what terrible 4cyl engine it had, would blast forward. For a few seconds or so before it started to wheeze.
But it really did make it feel like the car had power, as it’s the off-the-line response that most people notice, right? I’ve always been impressed that GM thought so shrewdly here.
Mazda did and still does this. It is particularly noticeable in the CX5s. 90% throttle = about 50% of the pedal’s travel.
I wish more modern GM vehicles with electronic throttles got the same memo.
I have a 2007 Escalade, and the throttle tip-in is awful, even after a tune.
My Jeep XJ Cherokee with a sharp tip-in feels like a hot rod by comparison (at low speeds)!
My wife’s Mitsubishi Outlander Sport is like this. Really happy to get from 0-10.
Back in the 80s/90s, when Chrysler was designing the LH cars, they did some consumer clinics to benchmark against the Camry and Accord. The LH cars were more powerful and had a faster 0-60 time than the Camry and Accord. But, after the drives most of the people subjectively rated the Camry and Accord as more powerful and quicker. After further analysis, they determined that most people didn’t full throttle the car when they were driving. Only applying about 50-60% of throttle. The Camry and Accord had better throttle tip in. They adjusted the LH cars, retested, and the LH cars came out on top as “more powerful” and “quicker”.
My grandmother’s Cadillac DeVille was like this. I only ever drove it once, but it felt startlingly quick for a boat that didn’t actually have much power (it was the 4.9, not the Northstar). The downside to this was that I found it almost impossible to accelerate smoothly from a stop.
Thanks for including the link to the dual-axis struts! That’s a cool technology.
I looked into it more because Honda’s page doesn’t do a good job of showing how it actually works (there is another ball joint or bearing you can’t see in their pictures) and GM and Ford seem to have come up with this idea in ~2010ish. Toyota had the similar but not functionally identical Super Strut before this (it used an additional link because the strut only had one point of contact with the knuckle)
HiPer strut for GM and RevoKnuckle for Ford.
This better be something that can be completely disabled. At the very least if I have to put up with fake sounds, I want to be able to insert my own samples: Weeee! Vroooom! Clippity-clop, etc.
I don’t know why Honda decided to use the push button shifter in this when the other hybrids all use a good old fashioned shift handle. I’ve had one car with the buttons and hated it.
almost all their vehicles use that button setup now (minus the S+) gas or hybrid
The new Accord and Civic Hybrids do not.
I thought the new Civic Hybrid already did this?
As far as I know, Henry Ford and his contemporaries somehow resisted the urge to pipe horse farts into the cabins of the first mass produced cars, or to use leather reins as a steering mechanism.
Was it simply because the technology wasn’t there to simulate a horse fart properly, or were auto buyers a century ago just more open to progress?
I love the sound of a good gear shift as much as anyone, but I’d love for automakers to find NEW ways to make electric driving more engaging. Faking the old way just shows a real lack of imagination.
Well they did stuff horse hair in the upholstery, and if it got wet, you knew it.
I’m with you on new noises for EVs, and would prefer a unpowered, tuned amplifying chamber to augment the Actual noises of the motors and reduction gears, and leave the simulation noises to the arcade.
“Was it simply because the technology wasn’t there to simulate a horse fart properly”
Pretty sure those Ahouugah! horns were early prototypes.
There were some automotive attempts but the idea gained a bit more traction with, well, tractors:
http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/reinstractor/reinstractor.htm
If there are no “gears” then the engine must only be able to drive the wheels directly within a certain speed range? I can’t understand how the engine can be directly coupled to the drive wheels and operate within it’s RPM range at speeds varying between 0-100 mph. Is there at least a centrifugal clutch between the engine and wheels?
This is one of the dumbest things I have ever read about. <facepalm>
I doubt I will ever buy a car newer than 2010 again.
I’m generally with you on that one, but we bought my wife a 2022 Civic Si, which is only available in a true 6spd manual. While I don’t care for the screen, the rest of the car is a blast to drive and can also settle down and daily with great MPG.
I really miss my regular cab, 2wd, 5spd Tacoma with crank windows and 278,000 miles. It was fun, ran well and only died due to rust. 98% of new cars suck. They are truly driving appliances now.
Happy wife/happy life.
Similarly, I bought my mother-of-a-certain-age a ’23 KIA Soul. Which I absolutely hate driving, but respect as a near perfect car for her use case. But for ME? Nope, not a single new car on the market I have any interest in spending the money on. The couple I do find interesting are so ludicrously expensive that I still won’t do it. I can afford a 718 Cayman, but I won’t, the price is just stupid, and I’d rather have an old one with the six and no screens to distract and annoy me.
Naturally, since they’re entirely simulated. At least with CVT shift points there’s something actually happening (never thought I would be even mildly defending CVT fake shifts, but here we are. Thanks Honda.). All this is doing is unnecessarily cutting power briefly, a thing which we’ve been trying to minimize in actual automatics pretty much since they were invented.
Beg to differ. This would drive me insane. I hope it can be disabled and keep the other actually sporty things enabled.
I’m sure it drives and sounds fine, but I just despise fakery on this level.
Let’s face it, new powertrains, especially hybrids, are without drama. Even the super-fast electric cars just lack the dramatic element.
It’s a good way to put it. I also like immediacy. Cars increasingly feel more like playing a videogame than piloting a complex thing in the real world.
The same way a fancy mechanical watch with all the escapements and ruby bearings will always be more dramatic than an Apple Watch.
It’s a good analogy – Apple watches are very common, but mechanicals are the provenance of enthusiasts or the rich. Which seems to be where vehicles are heading.
As someone who collects watches, this is correct. I have never owned and have 0 interest in an Apple Watch or any smart watch. I do, however, own multiple automatics. They technically don’t keep time as accurately and are dated technology, but you know what?
I don’t give a fuck because they’re neat. I think keeping an old art form alive is cool. I’m entertained thinking about all the little gears and mechanical bits working hard while I’m wearing it, and in what I’d probably consider my nicest piece (it’s a Baume and Mercier classima automatic with a bronze dial and rose gold hands and numbers if we have any watch sickos here who are curious) half of the back is clear so you can watch the movement in action.
The whole experience of wearing it feels special. Getting texts and emails sent to my watch sounds like hell to me. I wear and enjoy watches to appreciate the style and craftsmanship…not get distracted by even more screens.
Nice watch! One of things that is esp. cool about actual watches is that they have character, a real sense of what they are b/c they’re made to be something very specific. Smart watches on the other hand are simply smaller phones that go on your wrist. And very few people get reflective about their old phones, they simply want newer and better ones whenever they can get them.
I’m lower end, but pursue a similar ethos – right now I’m wearing a 40 year old Timex SportsQuartz. It runs quite well, has a simple “only what you need” look to it, and is as durable as its brand would suggest.
There are two kinds of watch people…those who respect Timexes and those who are wrong. I’m all for collecting on both ends of the spectrum, the Baume was a birthday present from my wife and family, and the other “luxury” watch I have is a Tag that my dad got me as a graduation gift. The main watch I wear is a Seiko.
But anyway, I couldn’t agree more. They have a ton of character and serve different purposes. Unsurprisingly I also have a decent sized collection of guitars, and I love all of them differently.
Have always wanted a Tag. I used to be enthralled with the ’60 reissues (yeah, the Monaco esp) but I’m now I’m interested to see if it fully brings back the fun and colorful original F1s that I remember from my childhood.
But since you mention watch sickness, I’ll note that I am excited that Chronosport is back. Now called Momentum, it’s the same firm, run by the children of the OG founder. First new watch was the Sea Quartz 30, ala the watch Magnum wore in the early seasons of the show.
I’ve often wondered about just exactly what it is that makes automatics seem so cool to those who appreciate them (including me). Battery-driven watches are cheaper, usually keep better time (as you note), rarely need repairs, and can look just as good as an automatic. But they’re not the same thing. I only have a couple of lower-end ones, so no one (watch geek or not) notices mine, but I still love wearing them and have no interest in a quartz watch. (I do wear a Fitbit for exercise monitoring but don’t want the size and (to me) ugliness of a smart watch.)
No one outside of hardcore watch people ever notice mine either, but every time I wear one I get to look down and go “hey that’s pretty neat!” a few times every day. And that rules! Life is too short to deprive yourself of simple pleasures.
People claim we can’t have manuals because they’re inefficient, yet if geared properly actually can keep up with automatics (gotta let the engine actually rev). Thus, I could accept a reality in which hybrid drivetrains keep manual transmissions alive, compensating for any efficiency loss. Was really hoping the Prelude would have something like that, but alas…
“Simulated downshifts also seem as quick as some of the best automatics on the market today”
They are simulated so couldn’t they be faked as fast as they want them to be? Am I missing something. Is faking them as fast as they could actually happen IRL really notable?
Also, who the F simulates 8 gears. 8? 8 is annoying in a real car.
Are they just picking annoying crap to simulate for entertainment now? Can it also simulate a confused transmission constantly searching for the right gear? Or how about one that holds shifts too long for no apparent reason? Can it also simulate the hard shift the first time my truck shifts into second when it’s cold out? Or how about the transmission surging issue that my Malibu used to exhibit when on a slight grade at about 2,000rpm? Or maybe the hard downshift into first that my Sky has every so often?
How about a masochist mode that combines all of this crap all at once and makes me feel like I’m breaking a wild horse? Maybe have it display a middle finger icon on the dash when its activated.
It’s completely fake, so why is there even a limit? Give me my Fast and Furious 27 speed gearbox or give me death! /s
As long as we call it the Buck Fuck light, which incidentally is what I called the vacancy sign at the hourly motel near my old house.
Just from reading about it, it seems like an annoyingly dumb idea. I’m afraid that in practice, though, I might kinda like it. Ideally, there’d be an easy way to shut it all off if you didn’t want it rather than having to figure out how to tune it out.
Honda is pretty good at faking shifts. Our old 2nd gen Insight had an awful CVT if left to its own devices, but did a pretty solid job faking a 6 speed DCT in manual mode complete with paddle shifters.
Pointless? Yeah, mostly, other than holding a lower ratio on downgrades, but it did a good job tricking your brain.
If it’s designed to trick your senses into enjoying what feels familiar on a surface level but is actually deception, then the answer is either hate yourself for liking that it can trick you, or resign yourself to enjoying fakeness over something real you’re told you can’t have. Both options suck IMO.
I suppose the best way to think of this is that the Civic Type R is the new Prelude and the Prelude is another attempt at a sporty hybrid. Well, kind of sporty. Nothing will pop the illusion for me quite like a combination of fake shifting and fake engine sounds. Just let the Prelude be what it is! I can have plenty of fun with a car that corners flat and has instant torque from an electric motor.
*Grampa Simpson voice*
In my day, the saying was “Money talks and BS walks”. Nowadays they’re both walking and talkin up a storm, and even gettin elected! When I was buying cheap-ass cars that needed tendin to on the regular, sounds and vibrations were critical diagnostic indicators that you best be tuned into. Dang kids won’t know what for and what not. Anywho that was the style at the time, where am I, can I nap here?
This feels to me a lot like the just-released trailer for the new movie reboot of Superman – an attempt to approximate the original for people who have no meaningful memory of it but know of it through cultural osmosis.
The case can be made there’s nothing wrong with that per se and it’s better than having nothing, but…if you have actually experienced the original, the whole thing seems kinda hollow and pointless.
Simulated engine noises?
F@%& that noise. Literally
-wanders off to yell at clouds-
They might as well put a fake manual shifter in it and have it control nothing but the fake engine sounds so idiots can do Fast and the Furious style shifting every 2 seconds and feel like big boys
That’s a thought: have the Shift Mode button even fake the tach jumping up or down along with the engine noises.
“Look, Ma: it’s a 12-speed!”
No one wants simulated gears
Or simulated engine noises.*
*Although if the options for simulated engine noises were say the flavors of previous ‘ludes I wouldn’t be so upset (CVCC, carbed B20, SiStates B21A, H22, and H23A).
Also, simulated gear count should be limited to 5.
I always have a Seinfeld-esque “Who is this for” reaction to fake shifting and engine sounds. The enthusiasts find them at best annoying and the non-enthusiasts won’t even notice them at all.
I feel the same way. The average buyer just doesn’t care about this sort of stuff and most enthusiasts will be negative on it; the likely target buyer group seems very very small.
I really wonder if this will be this decade’s CR-Z
Out of all companies I’d expect that Honda would understand what enthusiasts actually want, but alas.
Honda needs to forget about Nissan and give Gordon Murray a call. They apparently have a few too many bean counters involved in the development of what should be brand statement/attainable halo cars.
I also think that Mazda and Honda need to get in bed and develop a RWD platform that would spawn the next Miata (smöl sports), S2000 (petite sports), and MX-6/RX-7 (medium GT/sports) platform.
I dunno, Honda has like 2 platforms and their enthusiast stuff is pretty much charging 2x the base model for a tune and suspension. (this is an over-exaggeration but you get the point)
Beg to differ. The same crowd that puts fake screw on chrome exhaust tips is going to be all over this.
I feel insulted that they thought it was even a good concept. Non car enthusiasts won’t care, and the only “car enthusiasts” who will are, I can only imagine, idiots.
It’s like the lunch scene from When Harry Met Prelude
“I’ll drive what she’s driving.”
“Electric power alone from banked energy in the battery pack; engine power driving a generator and flowing that power to the drive motor; and engine power driving the wheels directly. It’s a wonderfully simple system”
I think we have different ideas of simple.
I think that was an unnecessarily complex description of a pretty simple system. If I’m reading this correctly, it’s like the Volt: Most of the time it’s being propelled by electric power alone, but at certain speeds it can be more efficient to have the engine directly drive the wheels so it can do that too. It’s a series hybrid with one party trick.
I wonder how small this thing will be inside? I have an 2016 accord v6 manual and my head is REALLY close to the ceiling. I can drive it fairly comfortably but I do wish I had more space.
I’d guess about the same size as the last Civic coupe vs your Accord. Headroom might be marginally better as I haven’t seen images with a sunroof yet
Oh that makes sense. Not having the sunroof would add a lot of space.