Gooooood morning and welcome to Shitbox Showdown, baby! Today’s is brought to you not by Mark, but by me, Griffin. I’m taking the helm for the next couple of days, as Mark is unfortunately no longer with us (he’s on a much-deserved vacation).
I’ve been advised by the higher-ups that I shouldn’t just push Corvettes on y’all the way I want to (I daily-drive a C6), but no worries, we’ve got a decent crop ready to go anyway.
Yesterday, Mark handed y’all an ’88 Mustang LX juxtaposed with a ’93 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme, both convertible and listed for $2,500. If you ask me, that Mustang was a clear winner with that red interior, and I’m not even mad at its tiny little 4-pot engine. The debrief on yesterday’s poll says I’m not far off:
That Oldsmobile isn’t exactly the most attractive machine, I have to say. That’s right, there’s a new sheriff in town and he’s choosing to take an anti-Oldsmobile stance for some reason even though the defunct company can’t even defend itself.
Anyway, let’s look at today’s options …
2007 Honda Element – $10,975Â
Engine/drivetrain: 2.4-liter dual overhead cam inline 4,
5-speed manual, AWD
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Odometer reading: 176,855
Operational status: “Runs and Drives Great”
Now I’ll be the first to admit that I used to think nothing of the old Honda Element. I remember logging onto Twitter during the pandemic and seeing this exact listing with a closing price of $36,000 and I thought it was untenable. Sure, it’s low-miles, clean, and on Bring a Trailer, but I still didn’t quite understand it until I did some research and learned the Element is actually a kind of rad car.
From Edmunds: “We’ve found that the Honda Element does offer reasonably peppy around-town response with enough smoothness to make everyday commuting a pleasant enough experience.” The EPA also rated the car for 18 miles per in the city, 23 highway for the manual transmission, which I’m not mad at for a larger ride like this clocking in at 3,500 lbs. Add to this a rather commodious interior behind its beautiful un-alive doors with those fold-up-and-out-of-the-way rear seats, and I kinda get excited, I can’t lie.
Aight but now you’re asking “Why else should I care, idiot? Big friggin dummy person, bring back Mark!.”
Well first off, ouch! Second: This listing refers to the Element’s “very rare ‘5-Speed AWD'” and moon roof offerings, the latter of which I know is pretty nice especially here in California.
It also comes with power windows and locks, which seems to be a rare combo as older manual-gearbox offerings are often stripped of nearly all creature comforts – presumably because an affinity for punching gears yourself must mean you like to do everything yourself.
Add to this cruise control, privacy glass, roof racks, and recently passed emissions, and I’d say you’ve got a pretty decent machine here. At some point, the “Premium Stereo CD System and Premium Sounds System” was a desirable, but lil’ 20-something me is stunningly light on CDs these days, so a trip to Amoeba Music might be in order to pad out the CD player.
Next contender:
1999 Honda CRV – $2,500
Engine/drivetrain: 2.0-liter dual overhead cam inline 4,
5-speed manual, 4WD
Location: Victorville, CA
Odometer reading: 190,000
Operational status: “Everything works”
I can hear y’all now: “Hey new guy, what the hell are you doing comparing an Element that costs 11 grand with a CRV that costs less than a quarter of its competition?” The answer is I don’t know. I don’t know what any of this shit is and I’m fuckin’ scared. But nevertheless, we persist! This ’99 green CRV is reported to run “good,” and has a clean title to boot. Sweetening the deal for you clutch-kicking freaks, it’s got a couple of new parts on it! The lister says it has a new clutch, throwout bearing, and pressure plate, meaning you likely have fewer repairs to concern yourself with in the immediate future.
Worried about getting this old thing through an inspection? Me too! Luckily its check engine light isn’t on. Excited yet? Don’t be! It isn’t all sunshine and rainbows, because check this out: “Just tried to smog, needs a catalytic converter.” Maybe a little foreboding, buuutt get this: “I’ve reduced the price to cover it.” So maybe it’s still a good deal! It at least explains the low price tag, right?
Looking at the interior photos makes me feel like a kid with those old-school cloth seats, so this one has a couple nostalgia points for me there. Like the Element, it looks like it has power windows, but jury is out on the power locks (I’m fairly sure you could never only get power windows, right?). While there’s no straight-on photo to confirm, zooming in on the radio appears to reveal a new head unit has been installed, which could either be rad (includes boomin’ system, yes!) or sad (shoddy install of Walmart junk, oh no!). Flip a coin.
My verdict between the two? Well, as Mark reminded us on Monday, “‘None of the above’ is not an option here,” so with that in mind, I’d say that the Element is my choice here, though I’m not particularly inspired by either of them. I think you should just buy a C6 Corvette instead (shit, I recommended one again), but being able to impress Bring a Trailer junkies by pulling up in the Element is worth the extra eight stacks alone.
But eight stacks is a lot, so maybe I’m wrong. What do you think? CRV or Element? Weigh in and I’ll see y’all tomorrow.
I’ll bet at 190K miles that tranny is starting to shudder at exactly 41 MPH, like all Honda transmissions from that era. (Torque converter failing.) Bet the seller is hoping the potential customer doesn’t notice that, or just blames it on a bump in the road. Gimme the Element, even though it’s overpriced.
Wait, what? None of these have torque converters….
Just one of the joys of a manual transmission!
Wish that CRV was 1,500 miles closer. I’ll get it to blow clean
I have to vote for the Element cause we love ours (aside from a lot of interior noise), though at the given prices the CR-V may be the better purchase.
You can’t do a title transfer in California without a passing smog check, and it’s the seller’s responsibility to do it.
So the CRV seller should get the work done and then sell.
What if you don’t live in the Peoples Republic of California? Thinking out of state buyer.
The Element was a great, underappreciated-at-the-time car, and Honda should bring it back at once. That said, no way I’m paying 11 grand for an 18 year old one pushing 200,000 miles. I voted CR-V.
Now, bring on the ‘Vettes. Tell your boss the midlife crisis lobby demands it.
I suggest a late 3rd gen vs an early 4th gen for the ultimate slow-Vette showdown
I like the way you think.
My family for the most part is a Honda family, so I’ve driven both. Even though the underpinnings are very similar, Element all the way.
First, do you have dogs? I do! I’ve had 3 Great Danes, a Golden Retriever and a Goldendoodle. Trying to stuff larger dogs in any car is a chore. The Element is hands down the best Dog Car ever built, short of a customized van. The suicide doors, the low floor, the split tailgate, the fold-up rear seats, the 100% easy to wipe off surfaces – it’s like a crazy dog guy designed it. It makes taking multiple large dogs to the vet or to the park a cinch. And it’s not just for dog people. Landscape a lot? Professional artist? Musician with a bunch of gear to lug around? The Element has way more utility than the CRV.
Second, it’s a limited model, made even more limited by having a 5MT. There are a bazillion CRVs out there. There are only so many Elements in good condition left, and the number gets fewer every day. I don’t foresee Honda making another Element while they’re selling the Ridgeline. Drive an interesting car. I bet the owners groups for Elements is a lot more interesting than a owners group for CRVs.
All wheel drive Element is the best vehicle I’ve ever owned. The only downside is the small gas tank made for frequent gas station stops.
Charlie
Romeo
Victor
I’ll take the rugged orphan in the back lot (leave the wreck).
My sister’s family aren’t car people and they have owned 5 Elements, so obviously some people love them. They all went well over 200k miles and were killed by rust in our snowy and salted environment. The Element is likely overpriced, but after looking at the current market, it wouldn’t be the most overpriced one out there. Just in the top quarter.
Did they name the last one Leeloo?
Leeloo Dallas Multipass!
Knowing my sister, the chances are very good.
That Element is just too damn expensive. CR-V for ne
That’s a ridiculous price for the Element by about 5 grand. I’ve watching prices for over a year, and a decent Element as described below goes for maybe $4-5,000.
I really like the first-generation CR-V – nice size, not too heavy, probably decent to drive, etc. And it’s a manual! I never quite got the Element, but I get it now, and if I had to spec one for myself it would be exactly like this. So between the two, it’s the Element. But at $11k, add just a couple of grand or so and I can get a diesel 90-series Prado. Big and heavy, but fuel consumption is about the same.
When I saw the prices on the topshot, I figured this must be a test for Autopian readership’s love of odd cars, because only here would this be considered an even match in any sense. The CR-V seems to be ahead so far, but not by as much as one would expect when competing with something that costs 4 times more. (At time of posting: 159 for the CR-V vs 120 for the Element).
The CR-V’s ad is a little sketchy, sure, but you only need just a fraction of the $8,475 more that you don’t spend on the Element to get it right.
Want the best of both worlds? Find a second gen CR-V. Costs much less than an Element but still has flexible seating configurations and has a better engine than the first gen.
So true, the Element’s price tag is CP. I can’t make any case for it despite the preferable 5spd manual and AWD.
The ad just reeks of “I know what I’ve got”.
Years ago, I read a study about the Element – Honda designed it for active young men (20-30) but that group completely turned up their noses at it. It was however, a hit with active middle aged men (35-50). I’m guessing you moved from the first category to the second.
It’s a cool car but not at that price. I’d go for the CRV, but I’d check for rust, even on a CA car – they are long gone in the rust belt and the Canadian government forced Honda to recall them for rusted frames.
Mine died from rust, but not related to the frame.
I had a ’98 that looked a lot like the photo (same color, but no roof rack, and mine was an auto). It was probably the best car I’ve ever owned. I got about 17 years of trouble free service out of it, then three more after an interesting hiccup (the repair shop quoted me $1,500 for “needed repairs” – all it took was a $35 distributor cap).
Ultimately the brake lines rusted out, and I wound up driving it to the junk yard using the hand brake, with my wife taking point in her car.
The Midwestern salt trucks did it in, but I do miss that car.
I think the popularity of the Element has inflated the prices; that’s a lot for that particular vehicle. The CRV is about right, though replacing the cat is going to be costly, all-in it’s probably still reasonable.
A direct fit carb compliant cat is going to be 3 digits and it will bolt right in so theoretically you can DIY.
Add about 2hrs of labor if you take it to a n exhaust shop. Pretty good deal IMO
I want a new Honda Element with MT.
I regret not being mature enough when it was released to realize what I was missing when I didn’t buy a 5MT Element. It was on my list, I test drove it, I loved it, I got into detailed discussions, but I was stupid and didn’t buy one. I severely regretted it since.
I voted for the Element, but that doesn’t mean I think 10K is a reasonable price- it’s just more reasonable than the 2.5K for the CR-V.
In general, I have a loathing for the first gen CR-V. Bad experience with one means I don’t think they’re worth more than scrap value.
The Element I can get behind. You can only get so much from pictures, but that feels like a 6K vehicle. A quick Google search shows I’m below market in my feelings. Is what it is, Element still wins this one.
That CRV would make a great Gambler 500 ride. No low range but enough grunt to get through some sketchy stuff. And that hatch for a few bags of trash.
Tangent: now really is the perfect time for Honda to bring back the Element. I think the styling they just introduced on the Passport could work really well on a new soft-roader civic gadget van like this. Surely the same crowd buying Mavericks and Crosstreks by the thousands would give it a serious look, even if it was priced a bit higher.
It would quickly tick the boxes for me if I could get it with the 1.5T/6MT in a new Honda Element.
I think it’s been the perfect time for the past ~10 years, and Honda has really dropped the ball. But it’s not too late! It would be a perfect candidate for a hybrid option too.
It’s tough. I don’t want that particular CR-V at all. The Element is in great condition, but too expensive, and in a drab color that sucks a lot of the fun out of the design. But man is it getting hard to find an Element in decent condition.
I went Element, even though I’d regret it not being in Kiwi Green. But maybe if you’re enough of a lunatic to spend 11k on an 18 year old Honda, you’re also crazy enough to get it wrapped.
the earlier Element green – Galapagos green – is one of the best greens i’ve seen on a car.
I also like Galapagos green. These days, I’d take any green.
I moved from LA to Denver in a copy of that Element. It was kind of like a supermoto bike in that dudes all loved it, but the ladies most certainly did not. I still refer to it as the one that got away (to the junkyard, after I wrecked it). Speaking of motorcycles, I was able to fit a whole dirtbike in it by only removing the front wheel.
I almost bought one here in the mountain south last week for $3500 (auto). But I have a truck for truck stuff and the GTI for other stuff and the wife hates them. Sigh.
You can find them a whole lot cheaper around here.
Elements have always had high resale values. In 2010 I bought one new because decent used ones were only around $1500 less. I planned to put 200K on it, but wrecked it in 2018 with only about 120K miles. Of course this was only a couple months after I put new suspension and tires on it. I loved that car. There’s on in the same parking garage as me at work, but it’s the only one I ever see any more.
I don’t like Honda Elements. Simple as that, so easy pick for the far cheaper CRV.
$11,000 for almost 200,000 miles?ballin on a budget
The element is the only one of the two I’d actually want, so I’d just have to hope I could talk them down by about $3-4K