Good morning! This week, we’re going to embark on a quest: We’re going to leave aside the projects and the money pits and actually try to find something good for a change. All of this week’s choices will be between three and four thousand dollars, all will be in good running and driving condition, and I will do my best to make sure there’s at least something interesting about each one.
We finished off last week’s matching prices with a pair of $15,000 classics, and in what was probably a foregone conclusion, the “secretary-spec” Mustang wiped the garage floor with the high-mileage Toyota pickup. A lot of you thought the truck was cool, but just too much money for its condition.
I agree wholeheartedly. I admit that there are a lot of other vehicles I’d sooner spend fifteen grand on than either of those, but if those are my choices, I’ll take the clean cruiser over the rough-and-ready off-roader.
All right, let’s get sensible. I’m kicking the week off with two not-quite-twenty-year-old sedans from southern California, both silver, both four-cylinders, but to make up for it, they’re also both five-speed sticks. Let’s check them out.
2005 Mazda 6i – $3,950
Engine/drivetrain: 2.3-liter dual overhead cam inline 4, five-speed manual, FWD
Location: Orange County, CA
Odometer reading: 160,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives great
The early 2000s were a good time for Mazda. The rotary engine was back, the Protege and Miata both got turbocharged, and the frumpy also-ran 626 gave way to the sleek new 6 (technically Mazda6, no space, but that always irked me, so I’m just going to call it the 6). In 2003, I got to participate in the “Mazda Rev It Up” driving school/autocross competition, in which we drove brand-new 6s, and I learned two things: I am terrible at autocross, and the 6 is a really fun car to drive.
This 6 is spec’d just the way I’d want it, with a 2.3 liter version of Mazda’s MZR four-cylinder and a five-speed stick. The MZR is a great engine, so good, in fact, that it has won the praise and appreciation of our own David Tracy, a man not easily impressed by engineering. This one has 160,000 miles on it, not a young engine by any means, but there are plenty of MZRs out there with more miles than that. It’s a one-owner car, which is good, but it’s for sale at a dealer, which is maybe not as good. Don’t expect any maintenance records, and just assume everything needs to be done; that’s the safest bet.
It’s pretty clean, with very few signs of wear and tear. I see the remnants of a stain on the back seat, and I think there’s a broken cover on the storage bin on the dash. Or maybe it just needs to be snapped back into place. It’s got the basic equipment you’d want, power windows and cruise control and whatnot, and the seller says the air conditioning works just fine; hopefully everything else does too.
It’s clean and shiny outside, and this is another example of the base model with no adornments looking better than the sporty model with a bunch of crap stuck on it. Its only cosmetic issue is the black steel wheels with surface rust, visible through the spokes on the plastic wheel covers – a problem that afflicts a large number of base-model cars.
2006 Toyota Camry SE – $3,650
Engine/drivetrain: 2.4-liter dual overhead cam inline 4, five-speed manual, FWD
Location: Canoga Park, CA
Odometer reading: 209,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives great
When the history of the internal-combustion-powered automobile is written, the Toyota Camry will have a bigger chapter than anyone wants to admit. For decades, if you wanted a nice, simple, reliable four-door sedan, there was no better choice. There still isn’t, really. But I also believe that one of the death-knells for the manual transmission will someday be recognized as the discontinuation of the Camry equipped with a manual transmission.
This Camry has the standard-equipment four-cylinder, in this case the 2.4 liter 2AZ-FE. This engine doesn’t exactly have the same flawless reputation as other Toyota engines; it is known to consume quite a bit of oil. The problem seems to be hit-or-miss, and there’s a chance this one is okay, or has already been rebuilt or repaired, at 209,000 miles. It does run and drive beautifully, according to the seller, and was just tuned up and just received new brakes.
It’s in good, but not great, condition, and it has a few yellow flags, like the cheap window tint turning purple, and some silly stick-on air diffusers above the rear window. Still, you can’t judge a book by its cover, and I guess you shouldn’t necessarily judge a car by its Pep Boys accessories.
The photos in the ad are weirdly oversaturated, and I have a feeling it was done on purpose to hide blemishes. What we can see doesn’t look all that promising: Scrapes and dings abound, especially on the rear bumper, one of the perils of parking in Los Angeles, I suppose. At least it’s mostly shiny.
The key to an enjoyable, reliable, inexpensive car, as we’ve discussed here many times before, is a manual transmission. They just last longer, and while shifting gears can’t necessarily make a humble midsize sedan into a sports car, it can help keep you from nodding off due to boredom. And because many “normal” car buyers don’t want manuals, you can sometimes get great deals on them. Which one of these feels like a better deal to you?
(Image credits: sellers)
In this case, I’ll take the Mazda due to the lower mileage and it doesn’t have questionable mods like the Toyota has.
They’re both perfectly fine with me.
Maybe you can’t judge a book by its cover—but that’s not the same as judging a car by its accessories. An author may not have much or any real control over what goes on the cover, but a car owner absolutely can decorate their car.
Voted Mazda
Now THIS is the way to do these. Very hard choice (when’s the last time you saw a manual Camry??), but I’m going Mazda. I had a 3 for about 9 years that I beat the crap out of and never complained. Only reason I got the 3 was because I couldn’t afford the bigger 6. 🙁
Voted Mazda today. Probably a lot more fun to drive and seems in good shape. Normally a Camry is a trustworthy choice. But there are some shenanigans going on with that one. The ad is sketchy as are the aftermarkets choices.
I’ll take the nice mazda over the beat-to-crap camry this time around. If they were in similar condition, it might be a different story.
Between my wife and I I believe we’ve owned 5 of these “GG” Mazda6s. All sedans (I’d have preferred the 5-door, or wagon but with an amber rear turn signal conversion) but they were all used so didn’t have much choice about the body.
It’s the better buy here, and I say that as a current owner of a 2003 Toyota (though not a Camry).
The stick-on parts are the first red flag on the Camry. Add in the cheap tint, steering wheel cover, unkempt interior, and disrespectful treatment of a Rosary (IMHO religious items shouldn’t be used primarily as decorations regardless of which religion they’re for), and it’s an easy pass.
As for the Mazda6: the 2.3L is nearly unkillable with regular maintenance. Solid engine, no complaints. Matches the character of the car, and while it’s more fun in the smaller and lighter Mazda3, it’s more than adequate for the 6 if you keep the mantra of “momentum car” in mind – much like a Miata.
Prospective buyers need to be aware of and constantly vigilant about rust in the rear wheel wells and quarter panels. This one looks OK, but have them professionally checked, treated, and liberally coated with anti-rust stuff. This is true if most early/mid-2000s cars – especially at their current age – but Ford didn’t allow for sufficient rear-half rust-proofing of these and their brethren.
I had a couple of these with the V6, which is a fun engine, and definitely more giddy-up than the I4 (duh). However it can have issues with the cooling system, especially as the rubber hoses and seals are aging out.
The headlight bulbs are possible to change without removing the bumper cover, but if you plan on doing an LED conversion, it’s best to lift the car and pull the bumper. Quality LEDs are a must (as always with automotive applications!) and immediately make the car look a few years younger, as long as all the light assemblies’ lenses aren’t “cloudy”. Sylvania, 3M, and Cerakote all make good headlamp restoration kits for the DIYer.
The headliner will probably start coming down if it hasn’t already. A good upholstery shop can replace it for not much money, but expect it to Take the better part of a day or so. However it gives you the option of choosing a custom fabric, including that play mat with a town and roads on it generally for little kids to play pretend with their 1:64-scale model cars.
The antenna mast rubber flex part is probably crumbly. The entire mast unscrews and can be substituted for a different design if desired.
The real feather in the cap on the Mazda is that manual transmission. Good feel, fairly forgiving, and no major weak points AFAIK.
So, yeah, Mazda.
Mazda for me. IIRC, those exact mechanicals became the basis for the base-level Ford Fusion that was released the next year. I had a 2006 Fusion with the fourbanger and the stick for about a decade and loved it.
correct, same powertrain although I liked the 2010-2012 Fusion with the bored out 2.5 and 6 spd out of the 2nd gen Mazda6 better.
I currently have a low mileage 08 manual Fusion I picked up as a beater for my teen. It’s kinda fun to drive despite boring styling.
Hey Mark, quick question. A favor, if you will. Could you do a round where both vehicles have a Jatco Xtronic CVT? I would really appreciate it.
Ooh one could be a Suzuki Kizashi!
Well then the Kizashi would win my default. So underappreciated.
They were suprisingly decent seeming when new. it would be hard to find one still running and for sale I think though.
I see a couple a year.
Yeah parts availabilities and the demographics of owners who would have bought one don’t speak well for their fate.
I both regret and also am relieved that I didn’t buy an SX4 AWD with a stick when I had the chance. I’d probably have spent less on it than the succession of nearly-spent vehicles I had instead of a car payment back then.
I’d add the late Mitsubishi Lancer GTS as a runner-up for underappreciated cars. I still see a few of them on the streets and seem to far better than their CVT-sharing Nissan cousins
I said I was doing GOOD cars this week. 😉
Oh good, I look forward to that article then!
Mazda for me!
This is a tough call for me because the VX30 Camry is a great car, and cheap to keep running with the tried and true 2.4 four banger. This particular example though looks like it hasn’t gotten a whole lot of TLC in its life. I suppose it’s a testament to how well these cars are built that this one is going strong despite over 200k miles, a good chunk of which were likely far off the maintenance schedule.
The Mazda6 we have today looks like it has been nicely maintained over the years. At this end of the market I’ll always go with the car that was loved and cared for by the previous owner.
That Camry is ragged out. Will it probably keep going for a while? Sure, it’s a Camry. But that Mazda has plenty of life in it too, and is in WAY better condition, so anybody who chooses the Camry is just a hopeless Toyota fanboi.
Oh the Mazda by a mile.
The real one to get is the wagon with the V6, a friend of mine had one and it was nearly the perfect car. Only one issue; corrosion. Every single 6 from this era has rotted away from road salt. His in particular, corroded so badly around the windshield, that it could no longer support said windshield.
So maybe I shouldn’t want to bring such a car into such an environment, but even then, this well loved Mazda is a far better choice than that poor, abused Camry.
Mazda, fo sho. These were, as Mark suggests, more fun to drive than their dullsville appearance suggests. Mazda knew something about making even its bread-and-butter cars handle well; in comparison, the Toyota’s a snoozer on the road.
Also, the Mazda sports lower mileage, and both cars are in the range where the odometer begins to mean something. Looks as if it has seen more attention to the shiny bits than the other.
So: an extra couple hundred simoleons and a day spent spray painting the wheels will get ‘er done for me.
Minty Mazda > Cruddy Camry
Going Maxda, though most of them rusted out years ago here in PA. I drove one once and really liked it. I also owned a 2006 Camry for a while – boring but bulletproof.
Mazda. The Toyota has had a much rougher life than the Mazda, and that spec Mazda is actually kind of sporty versus the Camry where the only sporty part is the stick. If the Camry was in better shape, and had less tacky mods, it would be closer for me, but the 6 wins the day today.
Those tacky mods are easy enough to take of though.
True, but the dents and scrapes are more challenging. The overall condition of the Mazda is much better.
Dents and scrapes be darned the Camry will last forever.
Were it the V6 I’d be inclined to agree, but it took Toyota a bit to get the 2AZ-FE straightened out, and this being a 2006 model is in that grey area of reliability. The MZR is no legend of reliability, but in non-turbo form it is probably on-par with this era of the 2AZ. Plus, and I’ve driven both, the Mazda is more fun.
Mazda will be more fun to drive and I won’t have to remove purple tint so it won for me.
Also, the cost difference between good tint and garbage tint isn’t that much. Just spend the extra.
Sure those Pepboy accessories are easily removed but the kind of person that would put them on in the first place is also the kind of person who would wring out the car on a regular basis. Mazda wins by default.
If the 6 was an Altima, it would lose.
If the 6 was as dirty and punked-on as the Camry, it would lose.
If the Camry was as clean as the 6, it would win.
Totally agree the 6’s base look is far better than one with stuff on it.
I think it would come down to engine longevity reputation and in this case the Mazda has it over the Toyota. Weird but true.
This isn’t Toyota’s best engine. I know some of them have the dreaded Northstar head-bolt issue.
That being said, my kid just bought an ’04 XLE with the 2.4, on my recommendation. The engine has had a seal & gasket job and doesn’t leak or burn oil, but I’m still going to keep a close eye on it.
So the Ford owned Mazda beats Toyota in reliability? Yeah I don’t by it.
For a brief moment, yes. This is when the bean counters started to hold sway at Toyota.
You can take that crap realitively easily though! I removed tint from my own car this spring/winter (I think).
Those Mazda are gone here in Michigan, if you spot one, its probably very rusted. Since these examples are from California, I will go with the Mazda this time. That specific engine is very good and the fact that has a manual and Mazda engineering, it makes a very good car that its enjoyable to drive.
I remember a friend with this engine on the Mazda 3, very good car.
I was impressed by how many rust-free Mazdas of this era were rolling around San Diego when I went there last year. My 2004 3 started rusting after 5 Michigan winters. The 2017 model I have now still doesn’t have any body rust, so Mazda got their shit together at some point.
About when Ford sold their stake and they went fully independent. 2014+ Mazdas are generally quite solid all-around. They’re some of the very few cars I’ll actually offer to stake my reputation on and generally recommend. That does not come lightly.
Was going to go Camry since it has slightly more equipment, but the cosmetic choices made by this Camry owner has turned this into a rolling red flag. Any car with stick-on vortex generators haphazardly applied to the roof is an immediate no-go. Add in a crappy steering wheel cover and a colored out license plate and I only see this as a basket of problems waiting to happen.
Mr.Regular of RCR said it best, If the owner can’t even be bothered to remove the license plate, you can bet they don’t change their oil on time, much less do the rest of the maintenance it needs.
The Camry is the winner by default. Especially since that one is an SE, the sporty Camry 😀
Mazda’s biggest advantage is the availability of a hatchback, which this example isn’t. And Ford made them only offer the wagon with a V6 because they were jealous that it would steal sales from the Escape/Tribute 🙁
If the 6 had been a hatchback, it would’ve gotten my vote.
The crossover boom was in full swing by the time the 6 came out and the Escape/Tribute were hugely popular, there was no bearing the wagon was going to have on their sales regardless of motor. I think Mazda chose correctly, buyers that were going to spend on a wagon over a crossover or van were going to want the extra pep and refinement of a V6. Four-cylinder midsize wagons were already few and far between by 2004, limited to some niche players – the Saturn L-Series which also offered a V6 and was on its way out, the Legacy offered the H6 but only on Outbacks, and the Passat which doesn’t quite count since it started with the 1.8T.
Yeah, the Passat (including the wagon) was also available with that shitty W8 too 😛
4-cylinders were always the predominant engine on midsize cars, even on the wagons, even back then. In the mid 2000s, the V6 engines accounted for 1/3 of midsize car sales.
On sedans, yes, which were the dominant midsize vehicle bodystyle by the 2000s. But wagons like I said were different and there were only a few other wagons on offer, no doubt a much smaller share of the midsize market share than V6 entrants. A four was considered a more economical choice but that was less important in the wagon over the extra grunt to haul people/cargo that a wagon was more likely to do.
Pretty sure that’s a fake badge. Either way the Camry wins.
Wait, nvm I was wrong. 😛 Wouldn’t be surprised with the other tacky bits though.
Mazda for sure. My Focus has a version of that engine and I love it. Mine’s been very durable and with a manual to really maximize the power delivery, there’s a nice balance between around-town economy and aggressive spirit when you want it. Too bad about the steelies here, but nothing’s perfect.
I feel like basic care would be all you really needed to get another 100k for either of these cars, and they’re both priced pretty decently for what they are and the value they represent. So I guess the question is which one is wearing their miles better. For me, I’d have to say the Mazda. The Autozone add-ons speak to a few mistakes in the Toyota’s past, but those are robust enough to shake off a few bad decisions. But I know that seat wear, and with the bolsters starting to fall, it’s only a matter of time before they give out into discomfort. Plus, the Mazda has to be more fun to drive, right?