Jerks on social media have been trying to take me down and make me feel old by pointing out uncomfortable facts, like that Weezer’s “Blue” album release date is closer in time to the Apollo 11 mission than it is to right now. It’s not going to work. I feel young and full of vigor and … oh no, did someone just refer to the E90 M3 as a “classic?”
We’re a little shorthanded around here today, so I was looking for an article I could write to help out when I noticed that Milltek was announcing some new products for a range of cars people around here seem to like. If you don’t know Milltek, it’s a company that makes well-regarded aftermarket exhaust systems for a variety of vehicles.
Specifically, Milltek was promoting a bunch of updated exhausts for owners of “Modern Classic” cars. There were some familiar models, including a prominent photo of an E36 BMW. That car debuted in the early ’90s, so of course it’s a “modern classic.” It’s not quite old enough to be vintage, yet still up there in age.
A few of the other cars were also clearly in that zone, including an Audi RS2, 996 911, and Peugeot 205 GTI. Then the last started to get a little weird. Is an Audi R8 old enough to be a classic? That seems quite recent. The Mk4 R32 Golf? I don’t know, maybe? I don’t feel old, but I am a hair over 40.
And then I saw it:
BMW M3 owners can enjoy an OEM+ look and feel with the Cat Back system with 70mm tips from Milltek for the E36 3.0 and 3.2 Evo M3 models. This set-up can also be used on other E36 six-cylinder models to free up more of the engine’s iconic sounds.
The E90 generation of BMW M3 is also catered for with Milltek’s latest Cat Back system comprising left and right axle pipes, silencers and valves. A key fob controller opens and closes the valves for an aggressive tone when desired, while OE-style tips maintain the standard look of the car.
Conveniently, I had my web camera running while I read this paragraph, so I can show you my reaction:
I feel very tired and very cold all of a sudden. Is this right? I know that “modern classic” isn’t a real category, but it feels wrong deep in my crinkly bones. The way most states have it is that a “vintage” car is anything over 25 years old. Colloquially, a classic is anything over 20 years.
How old is the E90 M3?
The E90 version of the BMW M3 debuted, as a coupe (so an E92), at the 2007 Geneva Motor Show, meaning the oldest one you’ll ever find is 18 years old. The car was in production until 2013, so the youngest version is only 12 years old.
I feel vindicated in saying that’s not a “classic.” I guess “modern classic” is just a term Milltek made up, so they can have it mean whatever they want. Here’s the full list, btw:
Audi UR Quattro 10 and 20 valve
Audi R8 (V8 and V10)
Audi RS2
Audi B5 RS4
Audi B7 RS4
Audi C5 RS6
Audi S3 8L
Audi B5 S4
Audi TT MK1
BMW E30 M3
BMW E36 M3
BMW E46 M3 (and CSL)
BMW E9x M3 (E90, 92, 93)
Ford Focus RS Mk2
Honda Civic EP3
Honda Integra Type R DC5
Honda S2000
Land Rover Defender L316
Mercedes C63 AMG
Mitsubishi Lancer Evo 7 and 8
Mini MK1 R53
Nissan 350Z
Peugeot 205 GTI
Porsche 911 996 Carrera/S
Porsche 911 996 Turbo/S/GT2
Porsche 987 Boxster and Cayman S Gen1&2
Renault Clio 182
Renault Clio 197
Renault Megane R26/R26R
SEAT Leon MK1 Cupra R
Subaru Impreza WRX & STI Bug and Blobeye
VW Golf GTI Mk1
VW Golf GTI Mk2 8 & 16v
VW Golf Mk4 R32
VW Golf Mk5 GTI
The range of these cars is pretty large. The 205 GTI has been around since 1984, and the E90 M3 was in production until about 2013, so that’s almost a 30-year window for “modern classic.” Not to make anyone feel old, but an Mk1 Golf GTI is just a classic at this point.
As awkward as I feel about this, the concept isn’t a bad one. I love the idea of taking a “classic” car and giving it a push-button exhaust that works like other modern cars.
In the video above, you can hear the system on an R32, and it sounds both loud while also retaining the”wookie” noise everyone associated with VW’s transverse-mounted V6.
The stock exhaust on my E39 530i is a little quiet, so I’ve been considering swapping what’s there with something a bit more stout when the old one starts to inevitably rust away. Of course, I’ll have to wait a while because my car is … from 2003. Is my car a modern classic? I guess so …
Modern Classic = Car that is likely to be considered a classic, when the time is right.
The only thing I have to add is I find it funny they developed exhausts for the urquattro and RS2. They will sell 10’s of them, seems like a wasted effort. They were low volume cars that are owned by weirdo’s. Also the first thing most people do when it comes to exhaust is a single turbo downpipe, so unless they have designed their system to accommodate I just don’t see this moving the needle much. I say this as someone who has been in the classic 20v owners club for almost 20 years.
An E90 is no kind of classic, case closed. But modern classic, yeah that’s legit. Think of them this way – ‘classic’ maps to the Euro ‘oldtimer’ and ‘modern classic’ maps to the Euro ‘young timer’
Look into Billy Boat exhaust.
Sound great at low rpm—and don’t get stupid loud at high ones.
Put them on my e36/37 and am really happy. I don’t like to attract attention when I give it beans, so it’s perfect for me.
-I checked & they do have them for e90
does it come with a Billy Bass?
In my state a car qualifies as antique at 25 years old. In 1965 that meant something. In 2025 a 2000 looks like any other car.
I disagree. 25 years ago you had no surplus of fake vents, no DRLs, no active safety, active suspension was in it’ infancy and screens were nothing like what we have today.
I’ve been saying this for a while, but the late ’90s to early ’10s will be seen as a highmark for automobiles as it’s a great mix of design, performance, safety and engagement.
Conversely I disagree with you. By 2000 pretty much all cars had EFI, OBD II, airbags, ABS, rack and pinion steering, standard A/C etc. – all things that we expect today which IMO separate a modern easy to live with vehicle from something that requires a sacrifice or compromise of some sort to drive on modern roads. The things you mention don’t really change the driving experience all that much.
Well, anytime I get a new rental I spend quite a bit of time bitching about all the beeps.
I was addressing looks. Cars made in 2000 would never trip your antique radar.
Think you feel old now, Matt? Wait until your daughter enters college and you realize you are still wearing clothes that are older than her.
Wait until you start a tax-feee savings plan for your first grandchild’s college. I still have the tie-dye I was married in (and my daughter was NOT a teenage mom)
I am eternally grateful to my mom for starting our daughter’s 529 plan. It should pretty much cover her bachelor’s degree, and she is going to college in the UK.
I remember when Torch’s kid was a baby, and now he’s almost a teenager.
Meh, it’s getting there very rapidly. As you say, the oldest are 18, Pretty much everyone thinks the previous generation are classics at this point.
There are some brand new cars that are referred to as instant classics. I probably made such a comment about the e92 when it came out so I don’t have a problem calling it a modern classic necessarily since it’s one of those cars that will be referred to as such in the decades to come.
I’m so old I read this site on a desktop PC.
Same. I also play racing games with a keyboard.
Most of the youngins don’t realize that if you want performance, then you get a desktop PC.
Actually that’s how I convinced my son to build his own desktop PC instead of buying a ‘gaming laptop’.
Wait….doesn’t everyone?
The performance to cost ratio is better than a laptop and you always add speed/performance to some degree without buying a new unit.
Unless you NEED to work when you are not at home, a desktop is the way to go.
Laptop? Nah. Phone. Yes, people actually view the internet on a phone without adblockers on. I don’t know how anyone can stand that.
The might be masochists and not yet have realized that about themselves?
Self examination is a lost art.
Source: look around.
The last desktop I had died several years ago and now I just get my kids and grandkid’s hand-me-down laptops. I haven’t paid for a computer for well over a decade. Free is good enough. The latest one even has a touchscreen! Fancy.
Well, Matt, when you go to RealOEM to look up parts, you have to toggle over to the “classic” list to find the E39, but not the E9X, so I don’t know how that factors into the math here…
BMW usually toggles over to classic status at 15 years. More or less it means they support less. At least they aren’t unsupported like Old Toyotas.
BMW seems to look at demand for old parts and sometimes makes runs of things that are NLA. Carpets are a common items they do this with. I’d like to see them make a new run of e38 glove box handles.
When I first bought an E30 it was in the classic section and E36s were not.
I swapped an E36 engine into it and now I keep forgetting that E36 is now ok thr classics too.
If you think about it, kids who are just starting to drive were born around when the E90 came out… We all low key consider cars born the age we are to be classics when we start driving. I consider (as does the state of Arizona) consider my 1994 Miata a historic classic car. Wild to think that it’s a 31 year old 20 year old car.
I’ve owned my ’74 Triumph Spitfire for 28 years. The oldest Miatas are now nearly a decade older than my car was when I bought it. The Spitfire wasn’t even old enough for classic car plates in my state at the time.
It is wild how time passes and you don’t really realize it. My e91 wagon that I bought new Euro delivery will be 14 this summer. Seems like yesterday.
Look, Matt, I have only recently begun to accept that the 80’s are not 20 years ago, so you can just get out of here with feeling old.
The 80’s were like 5 years ago, right? Right?!
That orange, however, will never age. It’s so good.
The date of my birth is closer to Apollo 11 than it is to 2023, so yeah, I’ve gone through this feeling a few times already.
I was so outraged to hear GnR on Classic Rock radio that I was spent by the time they played Nirvana. Yeah, I’m over this feeling. And the Hill.
What hill? When? Where? I don’t remember any hill!
My local classic rock station played Seven Nation Army by that White Stripes recently. I was so disgusted I even verbally mentioned it to my wife.
Napoleon Bonaparte‘s date of birth is closer to Apollo 11 than it is to 2023, so you are in good company
Ha, damn I need an edit button that lasts longer than a few minutes.
I meant to say my birth is closer to Apollo 11 than now is to 2023!
You must be young.
The date of my birth is closer to WWII than 2025. And I’m only 40!
I read this, did the math for myself, and came away profoundly displeased with the result. Time marches on, indeed.
At this point, it’s not marching, it’s sprinting.
No, I just messed up what I was trying to say! See my comment above.
I am nearing 45 and strongly disapprove of this comment.
There’s a promo for a presentation on the 45th anniversary for the Voyager 1 and 2 spacecrafts, and when I saw it I was like, huh?
I was born days after their launch, and I sure as hell ain’t 45 anymore!
If M*A*S*H were made today, Alan Alda would be dealing with the PTSD associated with hunting Saddam Hussein.
You know the movie 1917? Yeah…
I was born BEFORE Apollo 11 landed. Watched men walk on the moon for the first time at my mother’s breast. I suspect I wasn’t paying much attention.
In my current job, I am now significantly closer to retirement than to when I started with the company, and my employment there is old enough to vote.
I keep telling myself age is just a number, but it sure hurts more to get out of bed every year.
It’s only a number.
A large, ever increasing number.
If you were born after the Apollo 11 mission, then there are a number of us here who consider you young.
Do yourself a favor and don’t get into a discussion with younger coworkers about major events you remember…
One coworker asked if Desert Storm was when we got Bin Laden, none of the younger ones even knew about Waco or Heaven’s Gate, and they all seemed genuinely surprised that people under 65 remembered the fall of the Berlin Wall. It was ancient history to them.
I’ve been at my job since before the interns in the office were born. I don’t share that information with them.
Missus has been teaching in the same high school for a while. She taught the parents of some of her current students.
At my 20 year HS reunion, one of my classmates had recently had a baby. She had married young, right after HS, and had her first a year later. That kid had also recently had her first baby.
The daughter and granddaughter were going to graduate the same year, and my classmate calculated that when that happens, she’ll have had a non-adult child at home for 38 years.
I wasn’t that old then, but that graduation date is approaching, and now I’m feeling really old.
A couple more years and I will be there too.
ROFL – so true. I’m the oldest on my team (and third most senior including our boss) by about a decade, and several of them are young enough to be my kids. Heck, I’m the same age as the owners of the company – they founded it right out of college. I hope we retire together.
I was in high school when the E90 M3 came out and yeah that was forever and a day ago.
I’ve noticed a similar hard revolt in the videogame space when it comes to games in the PS360 generation being labled with the term “retro”. Games of that era are by and large fundamentally basically the same as games nowadays in design to the extent that many of them are frequently mined for nostalgia with “remasters” that just port them to modern systems at a higher resolution. A lot of modern game design elements started in that generation and many genres have barely changed since then, so the term “retro” really doesn’t fit as it had been applied for games in prior eras. In comparison, games that were fifteen years older than the PS360 might as well have been a completely different medium.
Likewise, when cars of the 2000s (especially the late 2000s) are basically functionally no worse than cars you can buy today, “classic” doesn’t really seem to fit as the term traditionally meant when it definitely would have for cars of the 1980s when people were looking at them in the 2000s. Is an early second generation Jaguar XK really a “classic” car when the F-Type (which was just an XK with half foot chopped out of the middle) went out of production last year? Is the R35 GT-R a classic when it debuted in 2007 and went out of production a couple months ago? What do either of them actually give up to an equivalent with more modern lineage?
Real vintage Video games are vector based like asteroids. Raster games are just old.
One of two video games I play with any level of regularity is remaster versions of Halo multiplayer with friends.
As a proper Old, the entire concept of “push-button exhaust” eludes me.
I’ve got old-school push button exhaust – loud enough to push the buttons of my neighbours when I cold start in the morning
Is that like a pull-finger exhaust? I’ve got one of those.
With a handle like AssMatt I can ass-ume he’s familiar with the concept
That’s sort of funny, because exhaust cutouts were very much a thing on performance cars going back to the 20s. Though they were “pull-lever exhausts” back then.
My car sounds like it sounds. Making it sound different seems…well, obviously some people are into it.
I suppose it’s just one more thing people can do to make their cars “theirs.” Okay fine.
My car didn’t sound like anything. It was just too damned quiet for something fairly sporting. So what the hell, I went for the factory upgrade. Probably makes 3-4 more HP too. I’ll take some Sturm und Drang over a breathy whisper (or these days a golf car whine). It now makes a noise second only to my old Alfa GTV-6 among the myriad cars I have owned.
Sure, things like this will make you feel old, but at least you’re looking at car articles and not video games. I just read an article about companies remaking old games and it was written by someone who talked about how Skyrim shaped their young tastes in videogames way back in 2011…
Atari isn’t even ancient any longer, but prehistoric. Intellivision is completely forgotten. The N64 is older than retro for a lot of folks.
That said, it does feel more shocking to run across this with cars. This is a hobby where there are people who still don’t want anything fuel-injected…hard to stomach anything post 1995 being considered a classic of any sort, much less anything less than 20 years old.
I have a 1992 Fender American Standard Jazz Bass that I got as a high school graduation present. I took it into a Guitar Center (at least ten years ago now!) and went to check it in before taking it to the tech, and the guy looking it over said “No need to check it in – we don’t have anything this vintage here.”
Vintage. Ouch.
Hahahahahahaa oh man, that hurts.
Why you gotta ruin my day? What have I ever done to you? I’ve been nothing but supportive.
AFAIK there’s no real term for cars in the 15-25 year old range. They’re not modern and they’re not classic. And cars in this age group can range from “The Corolla that just won’t die” to your E90.
15-25 year old cars are ones that Canadians can import to their country but Americans can’t.
There’s a regular, average condition Toyota Camry from the late 90s around here that’s on historic plates. I think this seems so incongruous because the average car age in America is close to what, 13 years now? We still see so many 20+ year old cars on the roads that it’s hard to picture them as “historic.” But go back to say, 2000, when a 25 year old car was built in 1975. I turned eight that year, so maybe I’m wrong, but I sure don’t remember seeing cars from the 70s on the roads in the same numbers we see late 90s and early 2000s cars in. Maybe in California, but not in Kentucky where I grew up.
The registration on my 2000 LS400 is up for renewal this summer, and I’ll be switching to historic plates on it. Here in MD normal registration is almost $400 for 2 years while historic plates are like $50 for 2 years. You’d have to be crazy not to go that route if you’re eligible.
Oh, I absolutely would take advantage of that! Do they allow you to run year of manufacture plates on your cars? I can in Indiana but you’re supposed to only drive it for “pleasure.” Though they don’t require you to disclose odometer readings, so there’s no way for them to tell. I had fun picking out the perfect 1972 plate for my Super Beetle on eBay!
In Maine antique plates cost the same but get you out of having to get an annual inspection. But you do need to have at least one car on regular plates. Same deal, “pleasure driving only”, and while you do need to tell the state the odometer reading at registration, nobody actually cares. I daily drive my classics every summer as long as the weather is nice.
For sure cars last FAR longer today, and it isn’t even close. I bought a ’76 Volvo 242 in 1986. That car was a rusty, mostly used up heap despite being one of the most durable cars you could buy in the ’70s. And it was two years YOUNGER than my BMW wagon is today. My first car, an ’82 Subaru GL, was junked at 8 years old due to rust. My folks FIRST Subaru, an ’80 hatch only made it to six in the Maine salt bath, the second one that became mine they had “rust proofed” – I guess it did help some.
Cars older than a decade were RARE in New England 40 years ago. It was a race between rusting out and wearing out of the drivetrains.
The Germans call them “youngtimers”. Old enough to not be modern, but too new to be classic. I have no doubt that is where they put this generation M3.
Canne here to say this
15-25yo cars were what I used to call affordable. Find a 12-15 yo model you like, and you can buy them cheap for a decade or a bit more before the parts stores stop keeping common stuff in stock
-bought my first 1980s Subaru when it was 15, sold my last one when it was 22
Your E39 is quiet? The BMW I6 is one of the loudest stock exhausts IMO of the cars on the “modern classic” list. My E46 can be heard for miles in the forest, especially compared to all the Subies we race against, and I still have a functioning muffler and cat installed.
Maybe I’m doing it wrong?
Something would seem amiss. I’ve driven lots of E39s and they were all very quiet cars with the stock exhaust. Especially compared to a Subaru! I solved the “problem” on my N52 e91 by fitting the factory Performance Exhaust (and the Performance Intake too). It makes some noise now but settles down nicely at cruising revs.
Perhaps my muffler isn’t as functional as I first thought…
I just about spit out my prune juice reading this, darn near knocked over my walker as well.
Was this during your vitamin pills and egg whites breakfast?