You might think that cutting a big hole in the floor of your car just inches away from your fuel tank is a bad idea. First off, what if you lose a golf club through your now perforated trunk floor? Second off, what if you set the whole thing ablaze with the sparks from your cutting wheel? Still, despite the danger, thousands of Americans “modify” their floor pans, and it’s because fixing their cars the right way just isn’t worth the time.
“Wait a minute, are you trying to tell me that your ex-girlfriend dumped you for Fred Durst from Limp Bizkit and then went on to land a role in Fast & Furious 3?! This is so great!” an empathetic Matt Hardigree, The Autopian’s publisher, told me last week. Was I at all upset about this being brought up numerous times while we were in LA at the Auto Show last month? Nope! That story was from 23 years ago and I’ve had a long time to get over it. Plus it is actually pretty funny in hindsight!
“We should use this ex-girlfriend story as an Autopian trivia question at the LA Auto Show, are you cool with that? Actually do you have any other weird ex-girlfriend stories that would make a good car trivia question as well?”
I agreed to the first question because, I mean, what’re the odds right? I didn’t have time to tell Matt about the other time I was (almost) dumped over something car-adjacent (since things were moving pretty fast last week), so I’ll instead use the opening of this piece to do so.
Virginia Is For Lovers…Of Pontiacs…With Holes In Them
During the Summer of ’21 I had been looking for a replacement 4th Gen Pontiac Trans Am (in green, only) to take the place of the silver Firebird Formula that I had sold that prior spring. I’ve had an on-again, off-again love affair with both those Trans Ams for 20+ years now and this was to be my sixth one…if only I could find it.
Well, during the hottest peak of that summer, I finally found the car I had been searching for, sunken into a backyard behind a double-wide in southern Virginia. It was a green ’94 Trans Am GT with T-Tops, and it was for sale for $1800. The car was about four hours away from The Evil Shitbox Wrenching Lair (under that volcano) in Wilmington, NC, but that was no concern.
Why? Well, my trusty $400 2004 4.7 V8 Dodge Durango is my ride-or-die tow rig and would easily be able to tow the Trans Am (with its lightweight fiberglass/composite hood, fenders and hatch) back to The Cape Fear. The only problem was that the radiator had walked off the job that summer, and the Durango was running warm. Not hot, but a worrisome level of warm.
The AC had also stopped working. This meant that if I was going to tow a 2,000lb car transport trailer and a 4200lb car seven hours round trip on I-95 at 70MPH, then the heat would have to be on full blast in order to give the Radiator a bit of help from the under-dash heat exchanger.
All in 100 degree temps.
Luckily my traveling companion (big shout out to Rei-Rei) was an absolute trooper (not the Isuzu kind) and was able to listen to my music (she’s not a big fan) and get furnace-blasted with heat for seven hours without completely going ballistic on me. We actually made the most of it and had a pretty fun adventure! That’s what destination car-purchases are all about.
Speaking of having fun, we encountered some local Southern VA fauna along the way:
This dude’s place was in such a middle-of-nowhere rural area that we encountered such rural-tastic celebratory decorations as the below “engine-in-a-tree“.
Rei Rei did tell me that she was very close to calling it quits with me over that radiator failure and subsequent tow-torture though. But she didn’t! What a gal! Once we were back in The Port City of Wilmington, a few Trans Am GT-celebratory rounds of Stanley Tucci Negronis and a nice dinner out at Golden Corral and all was well.
Ok, so there’s the other car-adjacent, (near) dumping story, but why was the Trans Am sinking into the ground in the sellers’ backyard, you may be thinking? And why was there a hole purposely cut into it?
Fuel Pump Cutout Example A: The Holiest Trans Am; Praise Be! Amen.
“You’re in luck, I just put a new fuel pump in her, from the top, maaayne!” (said with the most (lying), heavy Southern VA accent you can imagine) was the first thing the seller said as we arrived and started walking to the car in the backyard, which looked similar to the one shown above (the photo is not of my car, but from an OfferUp ad; it’s representative, though).
As you can see from the photos in the section above, obviously I bought the car (I mean, I’ve been talking about it here in various articles since I started at the site), but lets go back to the point-of-sale.
You see, the fuel pump going bad in a 4th Gen GM F-Body (Camaro & Firebird) can almost scrap the car. Here in almost ‘24, these cars are either high-dollar warp-speed missiles, expensive survivors with low miles that have been cared-for, or <$3500 beat-to-death clapped out Joe Dirt machines. The latter, of course, is what I gravitate towards and what we were dealing with here.
In a 4th Gen GM F-Body, to get access to the fuel pump you have to:
-Drop the exhaust
-Drop the driveshaft
-Drop the rear axle (!)
-Disconnect the brake lines (which need to be bled when reattached)
-Disconnect the e-brake lines
-Remove a decent amount of the rear suspension
-Drop the fuel tank
-Remove and replace the fuel pump
-Reverse all the above
…and all of the above requires a lift, or a shit-ton of patience, time, skill and a lenient HOA in order to do the job on one’s back. Paying someone else (most likely a shop) to do the job costs about half the value of the car. Check out the video above by Devon Lewis to see what a wicked pain in the ass it is.
The seller figured that he could use the fact that he had risked his life by cutting a fuel pump access panel ⅛” from the fuel tank and lines as a sales strength.
Honestly, it worked. There was no way in hell that I (or any other wrench I know) would want to drop that rear axle, ever. Especially after the car sat on grass for an extended amount of time and had moisture wicking upwards, rusting every fastener. So this fantastic fuel pump access panel got me pretty pumped since I was looking at this car as a long-termer.
Yeah, there was probably some added road noise from a hole in the floor of the hatchback body, but it was worth it in my eyes. Plus that’s what mastic tape is for.
Better this guy take the risk than me; I promised my late grandfather long ago that if I was to do any job, I would always do it the right way, the first time. And that means I would’ve had to drop the axle to honor my good word.
The seller quickly showed me the cuts he made for the fuel pump opening, but he did it quickly and I didn’t get a chance to verify that the pump looked new. He then quickly segued to other aspects of the car. This was before he put on a huge dog and pony show of exasperation when the car that he told me ran great would not start.
“If it ran great just yesterday, as you say, then why is it sinking into the ground in your backyard?” I asked. He then said he ran the engine, but didn’t move it because of some cat that lived underneath it or something. The guy was a bit of a country, wanna-be David Tracy Cat Rescuer.
He saw me coming from three hours away with a trailer, so the odds of me leaving without the car after burning all that gas, money and time (and nearly burning my relationship via cabin heat!) were slim. He knew that he had me — the sale was in the bag. The cat story, the “new” fuel pump story (it turned out to be the OEM fuel pump (from ‘95)), and the fuel pump access panel showcase were all just parts a smokeshow to distract from the engine and starter both being being blown.
Hey, you win some and you lose some though, right? Out of the 131 cars I’ve owned over the years, this one was one of my biggest financial losses ever (over $6K spent on engine replacements and other assorted repairs). I chalk it up to a learning experience and believe that it made me a better, smarter Autopian in the end.
Two replacement engines and two years later, the OEM pump finally went out this Fall. Boy was I thankful for that jerk cutting that fuel pump access panel! What would’ve been a massive affair was just a 30 min plug-and-play replacement.
You live and you learn. Besides, it’s not like GM would do this with fuel pumps on other cars as well, right? Think again..
Fuel Pump Cut Out Example B: The World’s Most Famous ’94 Park Avenue
I’ve said in previous pieces that I have a “James Taylor approach” to car colors, and it’s true: “…deep greens and blues are the colors I choose…”. I have two 90s GM cars, both are green (which rules), and both have holes cut in their floorboards. You may have read about this particular car previously, as it’s probably the most famous $400 car on this site: The ‘94 Buick Parkamino Avenuero.
This beauty will soon be converted into a ute, inspired by the wrenching heroics of The Legendary Laurence Rogers and envisioned by the pure, righteous artistry of The Bishop (even though The Bishop only moves diagonally, he is still one of the strongest that there is on the board). This ute-ification (dissimilar from Califorinication; not a Chili-Peppers fan) is going to happen as soon as we can figure out how to get it started.
You see, the moon roof drain lines have walked off the job (cheap plastic disintegration) and have diverted their watery payload directly into the fuse boxes on either side of the dash. Hopefully it’s not fatal and this 60K mile supercharged beauty started its next life on the roads of The Cape Fear here in Wilmington.
This car was parked under a Live Oak tree when David Tracy was a Junior in high school and stayed there until I rescued it last summer. The gas had been bad since the 2nd Dick Cheney Administration (about 2007) and it seems like someone took the easier (and far more dangerous) approach of cutting the floor for pump access/tank clean-out sometime between ‘07 and ‘22.
I don’t blame them, either. With the minimal value this car has (especially with soaked electronics), spending a lot of time, effort and energy into doing this tank removal the right way is a fools’ errand. Note: I’m spending a ton of time, effort and energy on this car.
Well friends, the 90s GM “H-Body & C-Body” (nearly identical; LeSabre, Olds 88/LSS, Bonneville) was also cursed with a fuel pump that was hard to get to and a fuel tank that was annoying to drop. So much so, that there aren’t any YouTube hits on the procedure that I could find with a cursory search! Yes, these cars predate the internet, but I was surprised not to find any repair videos on a popular 1990s GM passenger car. Here’s one showing the fuel tank/pump replacement on a Buick Regal, which looks very similar in its pain-in-the-assery to the setup on the Parkamino Avenuero.
Here’s a forum thread that references other GM cars of this ilk and engineering — similar to what the Parkamino Avenuero brings to the table. There’s little middle ground and nobody in the center of the Venn Diagram with these conversations about cutting access holes; folks are usually on their respective sides, and staying close to the poles.
I’ll reinforce the safety messaging here: This is a very dangerous task! Just look at how the previous wrencher nearly had The Faucheuse drive him or her away in this Buick, permanently. That is a sliced fuel line below.
Anyhow, the Parkamino had fuel that had turned to varnish/turpentine years ago and the pump assembly had rusted while sitting in that watery hydrocarbon stew for decades. Having the floor cut was actually a godsend, as I was able to remove the rusted old pump and clean the tank with ease. The new pump slotted right in, and fresh gas applied.
Crazy Note: The old, rusted fuel pump still worked!
After patching a leaking fuel line by the right rocker, popping in a new fuel filter and a leaking injector o-ring, I had fuel pressure on the rail! First time in 15 years, son.
Sadly, the pump didn’t get voltage when the key was turned to the “On” position and I had to jump the pump with 12V from the battery, but this is just a minor detail that will be worked out. The starter also isn’t getting voltage, so it’s not just a fuel pump issue.
But hey, it’s all good in this hood! Taking a massive project like this supercharged (future) superhero ute step-by-step is key. This is a project for fun; I enjoy wrenching as a way to disconnect from the stresses of this fast-paced world. Taking each task slowly and in a focused manner keeps one from getting overwhelmed with the larger list of tasks associated with the overall project.
The General does not deserve a salute for making these tanks and pumps so difficult to access in these highlighted examples. Look, I’m the last guy to celebrate Mercedes engineering choices after dealing with their dumbassery and cheapassery firsthand, but they seem to do fuel pump access right. Just look at the access here on The Bishops’ old W126! My Mercedes Crossfire has a pump that is just as well-positioned; well done meine kollegen.
We’re targeting a Spring ’24 reincarnation for The Parkamino Avenuero; stay tuned to The Autopian for updates on next steps.
Back to Floor-Cutting: “What’s The Deal?!” -solid Sienfeldism
It’s not just these two fantastic green 90s GM examples, there are tons of other vehicles where cutting makes sense; here’s the approach that many a 90s GM pickup owner has taken for their fuel pump replacement. It’s not just those that march in service under the General, here’s a thread on a Jeep forum with those dudes, dudettes and non-dude/dudettes going back and forth on the pros and cons of the cut.
As I said above, there has been two distinct camps going at each other, regarding the chopping up of a car for fuel pump (or other component access) for much longer than I’ve been alive, which is discussed all over the internet in conversations such as this. “Just drop the damn tank. It’s not that hard.” is usually the theme on one side and “Go for it. It is so much easier than dropping the tank.” is the take on the opposing side.
The various forums, Reddit content, and general internet commenters always suggest using metal-cutting snips or any tool that does not create a spark around a big tank of gas (for obvious reasons). This was not what the idiot that sold me the Trans Am used, as you can see perfectly straight angle grinder/cutting wheel tracks in the metal. Smart guy.
In fact, there are those who subscribe so intently to the Floor Cut Lifestyle, that they create/purchase products like this one shown above to support their dangerous lifestyle choices. Living on the edge of a potential fireball, having the local Fire Dept on speed dial and making sure the neighbors best not be privy to what they’re up to is their jam.
So Where Do We Stand On This?
We here at The Autopian do not in any way condone anything that may be in any way harmful to you, your neighborhood, your emotional well being, your financial well being, your spiritual well being or your feelings. Alway, focus your Center and balance your Chi. Be a hollow reed and let stress blow through you. Take from that what you will.
Is cutting the floor out of your car to save your bank account a good call? Perhaps if:
-the car is worthless (under $2.5K?)
-access to the pump and tank are a royal bitch
-you’re using a non-spark-creating toolset
-the car is not wicked desirable in stock/OEM condition (pour one out for all the 90s DSMs, as there are nearly none left, my dawg!)
…then I say yes. The Parkamino Avenuero is the perfect poster car for this decision pathway.
If the tank and pump can come out with moderate effort then do the job the right way! Expand your wrenching skills, spend some time in the garage with a good friend, grab some tasty beers and pizza and remember why you fell in love with working on your own cars in the first place.
If you’re thinking of being unintelligent enough to use a spark-creating tool/device, just don’t. Charles Darwin has already attained enough accreditation.
That’s it for Stevie G. for this one; hope you enjoyed it as much as I enjoyed living and writing it. Until next time, my Autopian friends!
photos by Stephen Walter Gossin unless otherwise noted
- Is The $1,200 Beat-To-Death Pontiac Grand Am For Sale In Every Town Worth It? I Found Out.
- How I Got Six Years Of Service Out Of A $220 Car
- What I Learned Trying To Flip Two Dirt-Cheap GM “J-Body” Coupes That Nobody Wants
- How I Saved A Once-$90,000 Mercedes SL I Bought For $1,900
- Why The Dirt-Cheap Broken Jaguar X-Type For Sale In Every Town Might Actually Be Worth Buying And Fixing
- I Took On A Bad GM Design In A Hail-Mary Attempt To Fix My Friends Broken Suburban But It Was Too Little Too Late
- I Asked The Internet Which of My Cars I Should Sell. Here’s What The People Said
- I Have More Cars Than Parking Spaces. Help Me Decide What Stays And What Goes
- What It Was Like Owning And Fixing My First Jeep After Owning Over 100 Non-Jeeps
- I Bought A 29-Year Old Buick With 68,000 Miles On It To Prove The Haters Wrong
- What I Learned Restoring A $600 Dodge Ram With A Burned Up Transmission And Ruined Interior
- How I Bought A Broken Version Of My Dream Car For $300, Then Nursed It Back To Glory And Let It Free
- How I Saved My Buddys’ SUV After It Died At The Most Embarrassing Possible Time
- ShitBox Showdown: The British Are Back In The Cape Fear
- Gossin’s Gold: Graveyard Garbage & Grievance Vol. 1
- Gossin’s Gold: Graveyard Garbage & Grievance Vol. 2
- Gossin’s Gold: Graveyard Garbage & Grievance Vol. 3
soooooooooooooo, you’re blaming the owners rather than the accountants and “executives” that failed to include an access panel. (rolleyes emoji)
https://www.clipartkey.com/mpngs/m/86-868071_rolling-eyes-emoji-google-clipart-png-download-android.png
The Japanese are smart enough to include an access panel. Just sayin’
It would be interesting to see the number of access panels per country of origin/manufacturer. There’s good reason why Toyota sits on top as the world’s #1 automaker. There’s also good reason why GM lost that title.
Hey thanks for reading and for the comment, my dude!
And kids, to be sure (after the safety warnings and all), that’s gotta be one of the found-on-the-internet pics & not SWG’s Firebird being fueled with the engine seemingly running and (in my mind) him inside maybe smoking a cigar and looking at a Playboy…
That picture was taken immediately after the install of the new fuel pump and the previously-dead battery had just been jumped a few moments earlier. I was forsaking safety out of worry that it wouldn’t start back up again.
I’ve already said 3 gas-station rosary’s for my penance and have donated to BP and Exxon Mobile by driving this Trans Am.
The cigar and Playboyseems to be more of a Gen 2 Trans Am; more along the Burt Reynolds-syle, but I’ll take it!
Thanks for reading and for the (always-fun) comment, Jack!
Way back in the seventies I was walking along one day and saw some kids building a campfire in their driveway (for some reason) right behind a typical seventies crap-tastic big three sedan. You know the ones that always seemed to smell like unburnt leaded gas. They were pretty much right under the rear bumper. I did my civic duty and suggested they don’t do that. They told me off, so I left it to Darwin.
On the evening news they covered the results of the explosion, destroyed car, house and damaged neighbour’s house. The kids had apparently been distracted by an ice cream truck and were unharmed. Darwinism is a hoax.
Ice Cream Truck Guy: hero-status.
Thanks for reading and for the comment, Andy!
This reminds me of the trick I had to use when replacing the fuel pump on my ‘99 Silverado. I dropped the huge 30+ gal tank solo the first time. That was a nightmare. The second time the pump failed, I unbolted the bed (7 or 8 bolts) and propped it up out of the way. Easy-peasy. So glad someone gave me that tip!
I’ve seen my neighbor do this a couple times. His method was to unbolt, put two 2×4’s underneath the bed from left to right, and use four guys to move the the whole bed to the rear.
I had wondered why he had to do it more than once then learned the design uses the fuel as coolant for the fuel pump. If you are always low on gas the fuel pump overheats.
Almost every single EFI car has the fuel pump bathed in the fuel to help cool and lubricate it.
It’s often repeated on the internet that running it low on fuel will overheat and burn up the pump, but I don’t really buy it. How hot could that little 12v pump really be getting, and wouldn’t it be a possible safety issue if it did?
Solid counter-argument. Perhaps the death of the pump motor is accelerated via the lack of cooling fuel bath over the long term. Hard to say precisely.
Thanks for reading and for the comment, Rust Buckets!
Even with no cooling it has to stay below some temperature in order to prevent combustion. Combustion requires three things; oxygen, fuel, and heat. The first two are known to be present so keeping the temperature low enough prevents combustion. He was probably buying the cheapest replacement.
I also saw him rotating the tires on one vehicle after replacing the brake pads. I had to explain how uni-directional tires work.
The above info on those fuel pumps using the fuel to cool the electric motor is some not widely known gold; thanks a ton for sharing, Mike.
Thanks also for reading, cheers.
I did the same on an old Ranger a few years back; lifting the bed is so much easier in certain applications! Looking at a problem from a fresh/different approach/perspective usually yields gains.
Thanks for reading and for the comment Boxing Pistons!
It’s definitely more difficult on pre-99 cars. 99-02 had plastic tanks with flexible fill necks but you 100% do not have to remove the axle and brakes. The last two that I did from the bottom I removed the exhaust and the panhard bar and the tank slid out. It helps immensely if you unbolt the shocks and just sag the axle as much as you need. I get it, it’s a cheap car, a little crusty, it just pains me to see them getting cut up. There are covers that have hinges and look really nice but the from-the-bottom method isn’t as bad as the Internet will have you believe.
Good to hear, and especially from someone that has the above knowledge-level on these cars. I looked into swapping to an LS when the motor was found to be dead; that it a wicked big job. Way bigger than expected. Love the ’93-’97 Trans Ams regardless though, even with the LT1.
Thanks for reading and for the comment, KD!
I took the tank out the right way on my XJ Cherokee when I was building a new spare tire carrier (flat with a big cool tie down ratchet strap in the cargo area, then a rack above it) and needed to drill into the floor just above the tank.
It wasn’t nearly as bad of a job as I had heard, though I think I got lucky without much rust on the tank mounts.
The only thing that was hard was my own fault. When I installed shackle relocation boxes my dumb ass installed them into the nut strips (which also mount the skid plate, a hitch and other accessories that need to be bolted to the unibody) below the skid. So to take the tank skid off I had to undo the rear suspension. Fixed that on the reinstall though.
It was $1k to drop the tank on my ’96 Sierra because it had a skidplate. I know this because I had to replace the fuel pump once and the brake lines twice. A mechanic in Niles, OH told me about a GMT-400 owner who put a door over the fuel tank in his truck bed to facilitate the work (I’ve since learned not to let the fuel tank go below 1/4 full so the pump wouldn’t overheat). The brake lines I’ve replaced with stainless steel so I won’t need a third time (check out Inline Tube of Shelby Twp., MI).
I had a 1987 Ford Thunderbird Turbo Coupe that crapped out its fuel pump during my second semester of college and being the broke college student that I was, I chose to replace the pump myself . ( Couldn’t;t afford to do it any other way) Oh boy! I had no idea of the fun that awaited me!
Remove driveshaft, drop dual exhaust, use crappy Motorcraft quick release fuel line release tools to disconnect the fuel lines from the fuel pump with 8 years of road grit caked on the fittings.
So, I would gladly have cut an access door if I had knwon that that was an option!
I have done this exact modification more than once. Up here in the rust belt sometimes it is the only way to do it without cutting rusted mounting bolts and making sparks. I personally drill holes and do the tin snip method. My preference is to cut the entire piece out and make a new cover larger than the hole and mounted with bolts and rivnuts or sheet metal screws to make things tidier.
Former owner of a X308 chassis Jaguar XJ8 checking in here. On the Jag, replacing the in tank fuel pump means (a) dropping the rear independent suspension to get the fuel line fittings, or (b) cutting a hole in the rear package shelf. The tank is mounted behind the rear seat back. I could not bring myself to cut metal in a 100% rust free JAAAAAAG, so yeah, doing it “right” took forever.
Since today is the day to find excuses to talk about the HMV Freeway (like every other day…), I’ll add that a suggested modification for it is to cut an access hatch behind the seat in order to reach the engine, as the factory access is only large enough to change the spark plug and, with difficulty, to adjust the valves. Anything else requires removing the top half of the body:
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53369262091_9ed6e78f2b_o.jpg
I make no apologies for the text being clipped in this image, as that’s how it was in the copy given to me.
I don’t run this place, obviously, but I’ll read avidly anytime you want to talk about your Freeway. Or the rest of the fleet, really: I think the world is a better place when weird stuff is on the road.
I had to drop the tank on my old 1999 LeSabre. GM changed the design of the fuel sending unit to one with much longer metal lines. No way it’s out without the tank on the ground. The problems I had were ones borne of relative poverty. I had to pinch pennies on the repair which made for some questionable choices such as using universal hoses compared to more expensive fitted hoses and reusing crusty fasteners that really should have been replaced. Whatever, it didn’t leak liquid or fumes and lasted another three years until the car succumbed to terminal tin worm.
But the GM beancounters saved $1.53 per car by not allowing the designers and engineers to create a removable access panel! Think of the stockholders!
“Think of the stockholders!”
Who ended up being wiped out in 2009 when the company failed, but, what a ride while it lasted
Because (some) engineers are assholes? If you have, say, a foxbody Mustang, have fun replacing the heater core. You basically have to remove the entire dash if your car has a/c. Unless you do the same type thing and cut an access port in the firewall from the engine compartment. Been there, done that.
Not a unique experience. On my Jeep TJ I had to remove the entire dash including the steering column to get to the heater core, which is on the passenger side of the vehicle.
Yup, was gonna say, most heater core jobs are like that.
Luckily on OBS Ford Trucks the heater core is the easiest ever, takes about 15 minutes. SO I guess they wanted to balance things out.
Came to say the same. I couldn’t believe how easy replacing that was. Pretty much everything I’ve had to tackle in my ‘94 F150 has been a breeze relative to my other vehicles. Everything except leaning way over to pull out that giant iron head from that beautiful 300 inline 6…
Tl:dr version: cutting a hole in your car to access the fuel pump is convinient, but dangerous, so always buy cars someone else already did it to.
Oh come on, it’s not that long; tons of pictures and videos!
Also, the above is an excellent used car purchasing approach for specific models.
Thanks for reading and for the comment, Ian!
Absolutely my favorite reply of the day. 🙂
To be fair to the author, every article posted on the internet could be tl:dr’ed to one sentence.
“Go longer, this is The Autopian! Deep cuts and long takes are integral to our brand.” -David “I Like Jeeps And Cats!” Tracy
Your tales are like a boy’s adventure novel from my childhood – you think there’s no way I’ll read all this, but then before you know it, you’re sucked in, devouring every word, and waiting for the bad guys to show up in a speedboat or something.
That’s the nicest thing anyone has said in my direction in a long time, thank you sincerely, Jack!
Hope all is great in Trade World, my dude.
I second that. I always love seeing the latest SWG headline when I open Autopian. It’s always an interesting read!
There’s another option to consider: a trunk-mounted racing fuel cell. You probably would be the only person to install one in a Buick, so there’s that. 🙂
On a slightly more serious note, I have to wonder exactly how flammable that ancient and polluted petrol might be. I drained gas that was a couple years old from the riding mower, and out of curiosity I poured some into a metal bucket and lit it. It burned slowly and with a lovely orange flame (meaning a comparatively low temperature). It’s possible that super ancient fuel wouldn’t be a huge risk but I am fully on-board with maintaining safety precautions. (I wore goggles when lighting the gas.)
My experience with super toxic dark orange 10+ year old gas is that it burns almost as well as new gas in an open fire. Still more flammable than diesel.
I drove overnight from north of Boston to Detroit to look at a mk1 turbo Legacy that turned out to be a total POS. After some swearing where the guy had the good sense to stay quiet before trying to get me to take it for cheaper, I just went home. As a note, those cars had an access port for the fuel pump.
Starting to see a pattern. The longer you drive to see a car, the more likely it has a hole cut for the fuel pump?
It actually ran OK and I offered him a few hundred to rip out the drivetrain, but he wasn’t willing to drop it to 10% of his asking price (and I’m glad he didn’t take it as I later found a better donor that was closer).
One thing Subaru definitely got right was that access panel under the rear seat, there’s also one in my 2006 WRX. Which is handy, since the only fuel filter in their system is located with the fuel pump
The mk1 Legacy also had a sock filter attached to the pump. The wagon was even better—just lift the rear carpet in the cargo area and (three?) 10mm bolts remove the cover.
My 2006 WRX has a sock filter, and then a filter after the pump on the same housing and then the lines run straight to the fuel rails.
My local Subaru dealer wanted an insane price for a genuine filter, saying they almost never change them out so I went and bought a Ryco filter which was still at least double the price of a genuine Nissan fuel filter for my R34 Skyline.
Props for including a link to your music and setting up the internet with Rei-Rei’s take. Autopians are a pretty forgiving bunch, but that’s still an admirable move.
She’s into Surf-Punk, so please include that in your deliberations.
If one is gonna do stuff like this, the correct tools are a must.
Did none of the imbeciles ever see or hear of air chisels?
Some ignorant, stupid shit going on for sure.
Air nibblers are a thing too. Even so, measuring is critical. I lucked out with the construction of the motorhome I did this on where the metal involved was so thin that I could cut it with basically a hacksaw blade, using it like a box cutter.
Further reflection has me wondering if those who do this sort of half assed stuff are possibly relatives of the Torch?
Feel better soon Chainsaw Boy!
I had a nearly identical green ’94 Trans Am that I was building into a bracket car two decades ago. I managed to snap an axle shaft and couldn’t afford a 12-bolt or 9″ swap, so I threw in another stock 10-bolt from another car. While the axle was out, I also pulled and tackled dropping the tank and replacing the fuel pump, simply because doing it any other time is a huge pain in the butt. I learned that the hard way with the ’94 Z28 I had before the Trans Am that needed a new fuel pump (the stock pump couldn’t flow enough to keep up with all the engine mods).
*You protect your own ass: I’m just a rando idiot on the internet*
I have heard-tell of people checking diagrams, videos, and manuals before using a $30 sheet-metal ‘nibbler’ from Harbour Freight. Not that >I< would ever do such a thing to save a buddy’s daughter’s car from being junked over a fuel pump. If I ever even considered such a thing, I would, of course, first verify that there was a good 3/8” between the underside of the floorboards and any possible intrusion into lines or tank—not to mention figure out which way the lines run and make an exploratory cut far away from them. Were I silly enough to do such a thing, of course I would secure the hole with good thick sheet metal with actual seam-sealer.
But, I wouldn’t ever do such a thing
I did this on a 1985 Pace Arrow motorhome on a Chevy P-30 chassis. The fuel pump wasn’t in the tank, but the problem was that the fuel lines were from the pre-ethanol era and were cracked and leaking right at the connections in the fuel level sender atop the tank. Dropping an oversized motorhome fuel tank — even when empty — is something even the RV service places really don’t want to do, for obvious reasons.
The fun bit is that on those old motorhomes, the floor is a multilayer affair of plywood over an insulating sandwich of styrofoam between two layers of sheet metal. So the trick was to carefully measure the location of the fuel sender, and then remove first a section of wooden floor and then cut out the sheetmetal & styrofoam “sandwich” with a handheld blade. No power tools needed except to cut out the wood layer. The metal and styrofoam layer came out neatly and could be re-used as a plug to close up the hole after the lines were replaced, with some sealant and another piece of metal bonded-plus-screwed to it to hold it all in place. Then the subfloor was replaced with new wood, and new flooring put down. The whole job took just a couple of leisurely hours, including replacing the full length of the fuel lines.
Meanwhile, somebody in the same neighborhood had a Pace Arrow of the same general vintage with exactly the same problem. They started in the Spring with dropping the tank which meant shoring it up, cutting rusty bolts to free the rust straps, easing it down bit by bit over a course of weeks, still having to shift it and struggle to get on top to remove and replace the fuel lines, then get it back in place, raise it back up bit by bit and then find straps that fit to reattach it… the whole process was done sometime in the Fall of the following year.
There are times when carefully cutting a hole makes a lot more sense. Measure, go slow, and be careful; use your head.
MK3 Supras had a factory access port, but it was only large enough to unplug the pump, not remove it. It felt like a twisted joke.
My land rover Disco 1 had a proper access plate, wide enough to allow access to the pump retaining ring and therefore complete replacement of the pump; same is true of the classic Range Rover it was based on. It probably cost an extra dollar (Pound?) or two to punch a hole, stamp out a cover and drill both for a dozen screws to hold it all together, but it just makes so much good sense.
I did it “the hard way” when I had to replace the fuel pump in my wife’s old Explorer. That one at least didn’t require suspension removal, but I think I had to drop the exhaust and I know there was a skidplate. The most annoying part, though? The damn pump went out when the tank was 3/4 full, so I had to siphon gas out into the other two cars before I could work on it. At least it died in our own garage….
What generation explorer?
My dad gave me his built for nitrous ’93 6 speed Z28. Fuel pump died and it sat in my garage for a few years saying “I’ll put it up on the quickjacks and drop that Ford 9″ one day”. Eventually I cut the hole and when I peeked inside, the tank was shot. There was crap floating everywhere. No salvaging it. Tank had to come out anyway. Don’t forget all the fun stuff that breaks when you do that either. Crappy hardware, dry rotted fuel lines, “where did this bolt come from, and where did I put the one that goes over here?”. Stock gas caps won’t fit the new tank, so I bought something like 6 or 7 fuel caps based on forum posts from 10 years ago trying to find one that would fit after asking Dorman what they recommend and got a shrug in response. What a mess. Ended up doing the tank, sender, new upgraded pump, new fuel lines, new brakes/rotors/flush, plugs, took all the injectors out for testing and cleaning, some wiring re-do’s and who knows what else, and promptly signed it back over to him. This is why we say “Do it once, do it right”. The wrong/half-assed/cheap way will always bite you in the ass somehow.
So I was just reading the other article on the GMT400 and thinking about sending it to my friend that just bought one (surbaban version) in red, to be a trail/camping truck. And below the back seat, there is a big cut hole for the pubp replacement and the previous owner who did it cut into the plastic tank making it useless. My buddy who is a gm mechanic talked thousands off the asking price and then went to a junkyard for a new tank. It is a real issue.