The 2025 Honda Odyssey is that most purposeful of vehicles—a minivan. It’s an important vehicle for the Japanese automaker, appealing to families in need of comfort, practicality, and lots of seats. With its latest update, the Odyssey still gets the basics right, but Honda’s left out one crucial ingredient that customers are clamoring for.
The latest model is just the latest refresh for the fifth-generation Odyssey. The first models went on sale in 2017 for the 2018 model year, followed by a facelift in 2021. Rather than introduce an all-new model after seven years on sale, Honda saw fit to upgrade the RL6 model once again.
There’s good reason for that. Sales have been strong despite a small dip during the chip shortage, and Honda didn’t see reason to fix what wasn’t broken. The new model brings the Odyssey up to date in several important ways, but one question remains. Has Honda done enough to keep up with the competition?
This Is What You Get
As you might imagine, the model hasn’t drastically changed. As the second-best selling minivan last year, having moved over 70,000 units, it clearly doesn’t need drastic changes. Still, Honda gave it the once over, and a freshen-up is always welcome.
A first glance will show you the new front bumper and grille. Other exterior changes include new wheels and minor tweaks to the lighting up front. The rear bumper has also been revised. The new look is pretty much the same, but sometimes you’ll look at the front end and think the hood is open until you realize that’s just a black piece of trim.
Inside, the changes are more meaningful. There’s a 7-inch digital display in the cluster, but you still get an analog speedometer. The touchscreen infotainment system is now bigger, at 9 inches instead of 8. It gets wireless Apple Car Play and Android Auto for convenient use with whatever smartphone you happen to carry. There are more USB-C ports, marking the shifting of the times, and a wireless charging pad.
The engine, however, remains the same. The 3.5-liter V6 has 280 horsepower and 262 pound-feet of torque, and routes its power to the front wheels. That’s enough to accelerate it to 60 mph in under 8 seconds, potentially under 7 if former tests from Car & Driver are on the money. It’s paired with a 10-speed automatic gearbox that’s smooth and transparent, as it should be.
Pricing now starts at $43,315 including destination charges for the EX-L model, with the base EX dropped for 2025. The Sport-L sits at $44,465, with the Touring the next step up at $48,005. For those seeking the best in equipment and refinement, the Elite will set you back $52,275.
What You Probably Want
In all that, you might have noticed the glaring omission. Honda still isn’t building a hybrid Odyssey. That’s not for lack of technology. Honda has all kinds of hybrids on the market, from the Civic to the CR-V. And yet, somehow, the Odyssey lineup is still getting by without one.
Fuel economy is where this stings the most. The new Odyssey gets 19 mpg city, 28 mpg highway, and 22 mpg combined. Those figures are not exactly stunning for a 2025 model. They’re also the same as last year’s model, no surprise given the V6 engine carried over.
The rivals have Honda over a barrel here. The hybrid-only Toyota Sienna will deliver 36 mpg combined without breaking a sweat. The new Kia Carnival hybrid is expected to hit 32 mpg or better, too. Meanwhile, the Chrysler Pacifica has a plug-in hybrid model that can do up to 32 miles on its all-electric range alone. If you’ve got a short commute, you’re using zero gas. Otherwise, it’s hitting 30 mpg and still stunting on the Honda.
Those numbers will be hard for a lot of families to ignore. A Sienna might be $1,000 or so more expensive, but you’d make that back in short order given the price of gas these days.
It’s not a huge surprise Honda didn’t throw a hybrid model into the latest Odyssey lineup. It’s now an aging platform, and dropping in a new drivetrain is a big job on the engineering and compliance side. It’s perhaps chosen to invest the effort into the next-generation model instead, where the announcement of a hybrid will make a bigger splash. Still, it’ll come as a disappointment to those hoping Honda was going to make a greener choice this time around. More’s the pity.
Image credits: Honda, EPA.gov
I saw a white one in the wild yesterday and I’ll say this – dang, it’s a nice looking minivan. The pictures don’t do it justice.
I’m guessing the Odyssey is a profit center for honda. the chassis is 7 or 8 years old so they have already recouped all of the R&D costs long ago. The price is fairly high for a honda vehicle. (40-55k) and honda consistently sells huge numbers of them. so “if it aint broke don’t fix it” and keep raking in the money.
If honda introduced a new drivetrain they could not justify that much of a higher cost considering the competition’s pricing. So honda would just make less profit. So as long as consumers keep buying the v6 like hotcakes they won’t put a new drivetrain in the odyssey.
People don’t spend as much on fuel as they think. You might save $5,000 over 150,000 miles in this comparison.
Some people like a V6.
Bigger head scratcher is the lack of a hybrid on the Pilot, which wasn’t redesigned all that long ago. You can’t find a Highlander hybrid on a dealer lot for the past 2 years, and Honda is still sitting there offering 18/25 mpg.
Yet the Pilot sold 66,283 units to the Highlander’s 60,108 from Jan to June this year. The hybrids may be in high demand, but the V6s sure seem to be too.
Throw in the 55,382 Grand Highlanders too though, since they’re both still in the same segment until the old Highlander likely ages out.
I bet the bulk of the model mix for both Toyotas probably leans to the standard 2.4T though, not the hybrid or the GH’s HybridMax, although even if it’s like 30% that’s a good chunk more. The Pilot may pull ahead in sales anyway depending how long the stop sale on the GH goes unless Toyota cranks out more Highlanders to offset.
Honda’s quite content crowing about their hybrid sales volume of the Accord and CR-V but that’s likely about to change with the hybrid-only Camry and likely next RAV4.
I still happily recommend the Odyssey.
Is it more efficient than the competition? No, the PHEV Pacifica and Hybrid Sienna/Carnival are better.
That being said, it seems more attainable than the Sienna and Hondas seem to have well built cars (ever close a door on a Honda versus a Toyota?) I also like a good Honda V6, and they are relatively tried and true. A Pacifica will never last as long, nor will a Carnival.
My ’05 Ody is shockingly similar to the ’25 Ody. And my ’05 is still going strong. There is definitely a lot to be said for the small improvements building on an incredibly successful history.
Because it’s not new. It’s a second refresh of this platform. They can’t just slap a new drivetrain in it.
I hate to state the obvious, but it’s a facelift, silly. They’re not going to hybridize an ancient platform when there’s probably a new Odyssey on the horizon in 2026 (probably to be revealed next year) that almost certainly has hybrid power given its current rivals. This is just a styling upgrade so it won’t look so outdated in the showroom against the new Honda styling language. (“Oh, but Kia gave the Carnival a hybrid in the facelift!” Well, the Carnival first came out in 2020 on the hybrid-ready N3 platform. This Odyssey is seven years old and on the previous-gen Pilot platform.)
Well as someone who got an Odyssey a year ago I can’t say I’m upset ours will still look new for a few more years (not that it really matters). This time last year we were holding off waiting to see if they’d release an updated model, once the 2024 came out and was virtually identical we pulled the trigger on a 2023.
The center screen is the worst part of our van. This new unit looks like it has the same dimensions, I wonder if you could swap it in to an old one?
Side note – as others have said the Sienna is way more than $1k more for the same equipment levels. After checking options and the markups around here it was something like $5-8k more. You would need to drive 100k+ miles to make up the cost difference.
I loved my teenage years inside and Odyssey and it pains me to say now that I hate them..
1st Mistake was the glass transmissions in the late 90’s early 2000’s. Widely acknowledged issue starting in 1999.
2nd was the introduction of their VCM (cylinder shutdown) tech that permeated all the V6 motors starting in 2005.
3rd was the removal of the rear air conditioning unit in 2018. The rear air is pitiful in late model Odysseys, barely adequate.
4th was moving the air vents to the B and C pillars. Any parent of a car seat child knows the woes of air vents that fire to the rear of the vehicle. Your baby is a sweaty mess whenever you pull them out the car. The roof air vents are the most simple and effective means for cooling the kiddos. Honda pulling the rear air conditioner led them to need to plumb the air from the front unit, which meant air vents in the pillars and it SUCKS.
I think the ONLY thing an Odyssey has over the competition is driving dynamics and that’s just not enough in 2024 to sell the car. The Sienna is the better vehicle bar none. Hybrid drivetrain that gets over 50% better fuel mileage. Dual a/c units with proper roof vents. No silly VCM that kills engines.
Only good USDM Odyssey is the 3rd gen with VCM delete. Transmissions are ok in those, and they didn’t get hit by the ugly stick yet. Did not hear about the lack of rear secondary blowers in the new models, that’s a total dealbreaker for me. Ridiculous that they deleted it as it’s something I’ve always hated about our Volvos and commended our Odyssey for having.
That’s what I have and I’m quite happy with it. As long as you get an 07-10 model though. 05 and 06 still had the old transmission. But yeah definitely install a VCM suppressor. I can’t even begin to imagine how much money has been spent fixing issues caused by VCM; I wouldn’t be surprised if it dwarfs the amount of gas money saved, especially when it only gets you like an extra 1 mpg.
I keep reading about the supposedly terrible A/C in the back of these, but I’ve yet to experience it in ours. Maybe in Arizona it can’t keep up, but it’s been fine in northeast summers.
The vent location thing is also way overblown. Kids are in rear facing seats for ~2 years, once they’re front facing it’s a non issue. If you’re going on a long road trip with a rear facing kiddo and they get hot just clip one of those battery powered fans near them. Everyone with a baby seems to have one already (we have 2). It’d be better if the vents were roof mounted, sure. But that was pretty far down the list of concerns for us.
I especially like the marketing picture of the dash with “average fuel 18.7 mpg, range 246 miles” with most of a tank of gas left. Quite impressive Honda, right up there with my almost 30 year old Jeep on mud tires.
The hybrid setup in the Accord/CRV is begging to be paired with a larger battery to enable a range extended EV/PHEV setup, where the engine is only used for highway cruising.
This Odyssey is considerably larger, and almost one Volkswagen Beetle heavier, than your 30 year old Jeep. So yeah, I’d say that’s quite impressive.
Honestly, I’ve been pretty disappointed with Honda for a while now, and this is just another example of Honda… doing nothing?
Seriously, Honda has hardly done anything excited or worth really reporting on for years now. They still make some nice cars, but hardly anything to be excited about. You can say that for a number of manufacturers these days, but hell, Honda hardly even bothers to tart up their existing models in interesting ways. Does this even qualify as a refresh? It almost makes me hungry for some cynical badging and trim jobs.
Dropping the EX is lame, but hasn’t built any in meaningful numbers since ’21 anyway, so it doesn’t really matter. Glad to see that a van you could buy in 2018 for 31k now costs 44k.
Is it really the same SOHC engine, or did they change it to the newer DOHC version used in the Pilot? Same HP ratings, so you can’t tell just from the numbers.
Pretty sure it’s the dohc.
Why the hell isn’t everything PHEV AWD??
Because most cars shouldn’t be AWD.
Ok big guy. Congrats on the mild climate
Not a mild climate, I live in Idaho and drive in real snow every winter, in RWD and FWD cars. AWD or 4WD can be nice, but unnecessary and wasteful for the majority of customers.
When you were a kid, your parents drove you around in a 2wd car, and you were fine. If you’re old enough, your parents probably drove you around in a RWD sedan on bias ply tires. And you were fine.
I live at altitude in the Rockies. I have studded snows. I have a switch to go from 2WD to 4WD. I engage it when I start sliding, and I stop sliding. I am taking the AWD option over the 2WD option every time. If you want to roll the dice because that’s what your parents did, you’re more than welcome to
And for some reason you think that living at altitude in the Rockies is remotely representative of the car buying public’s needs? When I say AWD is unnecessary for the majority of customers, you are the minority. You are not who I’m talking about. I didnt think that was too hard to understand.
AWD doesn’t help you in snow/sand/mud. Appropriate tires help you.
This is a try-hard take that stretches common sense. When I’m on a mountain pass and there’s snow and ice, I’ll take the car with AWD and winter tires over the car with FWD and winter tires 10/10 times. You and everyone else would too. No one is saying to ditch winter tires for AWD. Getting AWD doesn’t all of a sudden exclude me from purchasing and installing studded winters
What is AWD in such a front biased platform from the Odyssey going to do? At most it’ll send 10% of the power to the rear which is barely enough to move the wheels. It would be as useless as the AWD Altima or AWD Prius. Not to mention the need for a rear diff/motor in the rear would take away from packaging space for the rear seat passengers. This is not a try-hard take, this is a take from someone who works directly in the industry. The additional cost of the rear diff/motor could be better spent on a separate set of tires.
Both AWD and good tires help you in poor conditions, although, in my experience, AWD/4WD helps you significantly more than tires do.
In my area, eastern ontario, we get loads of snow, rain and ice for about 1/2 the year. Drove a subaru tribeca for years, switched to a honda accord as my daily 6 yrs back. Ive always put winter tires on both. The only thing the awd subaru does is lighten my wallet due to its gas guzzling nature. Awd is vastly overrated in my experience.
A Pacifica PHEV would be tempting as a do-it-all (except for urban flingability and fun) kind of vehicle, and I remember seeing some screaming deals after hefty factory incentives right before the lockdown. But one way Chrysler kept fuel consumption low was to make sure it spent most of its time on a tow truck or in the shop, bless its little hybridized heart.
Honda knows it’s market. People who buy these, keep them for 15 year, put 250K miles on them and their kids beat the hell out of them. Then it gets passed on to the oldest child who will promptly drive it into a ditch. These people do not want a car they have to spend $10K on to replace a hybrid battery in 6 months after the warranty expires.
This is not a thing
Honda has VTEC yo
The kids get all fast and furious 😀
As a dad of 3 grown boys and former owner of a minivan, I assure that it most certainly is. I know 4 people right now that have a family and Odyssey with over 200K that they have had for years.
According to Toyota the cost to replace a hybrid battery is $3,000 to $8,000. With the size required for a minivan it would be on the higher end of that spectrum.
On Carfax, there are 8 Odysseys currently for sale with over 200K miles and one owner within 250 miles of me.
I should clarify – routinely replacing the hybrid battery 6 mo after the warranty expires is not a thing. Most hybrid batteries will last 250k at least.
While your interval and costs look like fiction based on “ElEcTrIc BaD”, at a more realistic battery replacement interval of ~150K miles and price of $8K, you’d only come out something like $1K ahead vs gas for the Honda. Could easily end up a wash if gas prices drop.
Not true, I want an electric vehicle and think it is definitely the way forward, but at this point it simply does not make sense to me economically. There is a huge difference in paying out $50 a week for gas, and spending $8,000 on a 10+ year old mini van. Age matters to batteries too, not just mileage. If you are a person who buys a new car every 5 years, or leases one, I don’t know why you would not go electric. My point is, that is not the Honda Odyssey market. Electric does not make sense for everyone and everything yet. I have no doubt it will get there, but it is not there yet.
For example, I have a 2011 Toyota Camry that has 178,000 miles on it. I bought it in 2014 years old with 29,000 miles on it. I plan to drive it for another year or so and then pass it on to my son. With maintenance and basic repairs it could easily go 250,000 miles. If it was a hybrid or electric, it would either already be, in or soon headed to, the junkyard. It simply would not be worth the cost to replace the battery.
Honda should use the HR-V’s K20 for the Ody hybrid. And the V6 should be replaced by the 250 hp 2.0T from the previous Accord.
The 2.0T in that large of a package will be in the boost most of the time. In the Accord, the 2.0T was only slightly better MPG than the V6 it replaced as long as you didn’t send it all the time. The increased mass and drag of the Ody I would venture wouldn’t pair well with the small turbo engine.
Something like one of the smaller V6 with turbo from the Acura side of the house might be slightly better option, much like the switch of engines in the previous gen Accord. This could hold the line until the next full generation update for the Ody.
I’d like to see a stout hybrid powertrain offering that could be used in the Ody, Pilot, Passport and Ridgeline. Capable of 5000 lb towing and/or handing a full van load of stuff/people, while being more spry than what the Sienna can muster.
The upcoming Carnival hybrid will have a 1.6T, and the non-hybrid is already sold with a 2.0T in other markets.
Also, the Honda V6 still uses a timing belt, while the fours all have a chain now.
Yeah, the belt thing is something I’m not wild about. Doing a replacement on some smaller I4 with space around it wasn’t too bad. Looking at needing one replaced on a Ridgeline and though the price is not cheap, I’m not taking it on myself.
The Carnival is sold with a 2.0L T-GDi in China, but I cannot find much info on how efficient it is and whether it is tuned to the same objective as Honda’s 2.0L Accord engine.
Get the timing belt done at the dealer. Some people have reported problems with the Aisin water pumps on V6 Hondas that are included in the Aisin TB kit. Aisin is no longer Honda’s OE supplier for the water pumps; they use Yamada now.
The Aisin WP might make a warbling noise. It’s annoying, but doesn’t actually cause any problems.
Too bad there’s no 4-cyl Ridgeline 🙁
Thx for the advice. I’m definitely using quality Honda OE parts, but I have a good independent mechanic that is able to do the work.
A 2 liter engine will be in the boost most of the time, or all of the time when it is loaded down or has a trailer.
For gasoline engines, being in the boost is typically extremely inefficient, to the extent that a 2.0 under boost will burn more fuel than a 3.5 not under boost.
yet, there are turbo-4 full-size trucks made by companies far inferior to Honda. If they can do it, so can Honda 🙂
Toyota made a (non-turbo) 4-cylinder Sienna over 10 years ago, the previous gen, almost as heavy as the current one. Its 190 hp is plenty.
A turbo four cylinder in an oversized vehicle is obviously possible, just not a good idea. Companies(its actually just Chevy) inferior to Honda can do it, because Honda is smart enough not to try.
There are fullsize pickups with turbo fours, but the fuel economy and reliability is worse than a naturally aspirated six cylinder better suited to the application. And the fuel economy is WAY worse when you actually load it down.
I mean this all to be expected from a second facelift of a dated model. The Europeans seem fond of introducing new powertrains halfway through a platforms life so they basically update the chassis and the powertrain on an alternating basis, but the Japanese almost never do that.
You’re forgetting or ignoring the fact that there are still customers out there that want nothing to do with EVs or hybrids are anything more than a simple ICE. They are convinced that huge bills would await them for battery replacements, that these vehicles are no more environmentally friendly than their gas burning options and it’s just a big government conspiracy to push electrification down our throats. I’m not one of those people but I know an awful lot of them and I’m positive they’re a much larger population than you realize.
Good point (sadly) but would those people be considering “foreign” makes in the first place?
to me it seems that those people also embraced the Toyota, Hyundai and Kia as their own.
I think those buyers would tend to be split between looking at the brand’s HQ/origin, and domestic parts content. For the latter, Odyssey and most of its platformmates have long been in the top 10. Sienna used to be high up as well, but seems like the current gen, maybe from the switch to all hybrid, knocked down its domestic parts content.
For the brand, Honda/Toyota seem to be mostly accepted as Clutch Rider said except in the truck space. But there hasn’t technically been a true American-brand minivan in a while when you consider Chrysler’s ownership over the last several years.
Most of those buyers are not interested in data, but are driven by their own convictions. Data shows that hybrids are more eco-friendly and rarely need their HV batteries replaced.
They buy crew-cab trucks from the big 2 1/2. They’re not buying minivans.
As you said, these probably aren’t buying minivans. Those are more likely to buy a domestic brand truck that actually may actually have a VIN beginning with 2…or 3 (!).
As somebody who is not interested in a hybrid and drives a Honda, yes.
Toyota is the only brand that doesn’t give them a choice of powertrain, though. Kia and Chrysler still offer the normal gas-only drivetrain across the range. So the Odyssey still has to compete directly with the Kia (tough) and Chrysler (not as tough) in the gas-only market, and they have nothing to offer in the hybrid space to compete with the other three.
I think Lewin’s point that they’re saving the development cost for the next platform is probably spot-on, since there would need to be some chassis modifications to stick in a battery pack, even if the Accord hybrid drivetrain would probably slot in to the engine bay without much difficulty. It’s a shame that they’re lagging behind, though. The Odyssey is a pretty great vehicle, other than front rotor warping issues.
While the short trips a lot of vans do are perfect hybrid use cases, I imagine there are some van buyers that do more highway cruising and don’t see as much benefit even with the narrowing price premiums of a hybrid. The V6s can turn pretty lazily on the highway and stretch to nearly 30mpg which is pretty good for their size. VCM & a timing belt don’t really make the Odyssey uncomplicated long term though either.
While true, I don’t think there’s a lot of overlap in the Venn diagram of “EV’s are evil, I won’t let biden take my gas powered car, climate change is a hoax!” people and “I’m in the market for a new minivan and open to considering a Honda” people
Where I live, I think almost everybody is in the overlap of that venn diagram. Those people most certainly exist.
Well not you’ve got my curiosity, where is that? I can’t think of any groups/areas that are generally climate denier EV haters but also totally cool with buying a Japanese minivan.
Idaho. Odysseys and Siennas are everywhere, just like the rest of the US. I also wouldnt characterize the population here as generally EV haters, there are lots of good reasons to buy an EV and many do, but most people here are absolutely “climate change is a hoax, I wont let Biden take my gas powered car”
Sure the Toyota went exclusively hybrid but that doesn’t mean that Honda couldn’t make it an option and keep the V6 too.
I’m (basically) one of those people. I am not interested in the expensive complexity and poor serviceability of a 2024 model year hybrid, which is questionably worth the overstated economy gains.
But I also wouldn’t consider a 2024 pure ICE non-hybrid because of the expensive complexity and poor serviceability.
There’s no Pilot or Passport hybrid either and it seems like a glaring omission. Honda knows how to make a hybrid and many of this platform’s competitors (Highlander/Sienna, Carnival/Santa Fe/Sorrento, Pacifica, etc.) offer them. As I’ve said a bajillion times already, there’s no reason whatsoever that family haulers shouldn’t be electrified across the board. Acura also has 0 hybrids and is competing against Lexus, who will sell you a hybrid version of basically all of their cars. I mean shit, there’s an LC500 hybrid for fuck’s sake.
To add insult to injury this NA V6 is very thirsty. I’m sure the simplicity and reliability are more than enough for a lot of buyers to be willing to make that compromise, but most people want hybrids right now. I think the main issue is that Honda’s hybrid powertrain is designed for smaller cars. It works in the Civic, Accord, and CRV but it’s not enough to move their bigger vehicles along.
Plus Honda has the Prologue now, which is kinda sorta in this class. Regardless they’re not going to go back to the drawing board this late in the game and they have strong enough brand that not having a hybrid probably won’t lose them any customers. But selfishly I’d love a hybrid Pilot.
Own an aging MDX and will likely replace it with a Toyota SUV hybrid when finances allow. It is a thirsty beast.
Nice, barely used or certified current gen MDXs pop up in the high 30s/low 40s near me all the time. My wife likes them, I like them, they seem like a good thing to consider for her next car…until you look at the fuel economy.
We live in DC and are lucky if whatever we drive averages its EPA city rating over its lifetime. My GTI averaged 2 under its city rating (22) and my Kona N is sitting right at its city rating, an abysmal 20 MPG. So if we got my wife a Honda V6 vehicle we’d be doing well if we averaged high teens…and for us unfortunately that’s a non starter in 2024.
Any new vehicle sold in 2024 should be higher than 20 in every situation. Even the trucks. It’s pretty pathetic they won’t.
30+mpg highway in a quite large minivan, honestly sneaking up on the size of a fullsize SUV, isn’t what I’d call “very thirsty”.
If you’re doing a lot of highway driving then it’s great. If you’re doing a lot of putting around town you’ll probably be in the teens.
If you scroll marginally down to Highland Green Miata’s comment, you will see that he reports real world mpg of 24 city/31 highway, which is great.
EPA fuel economy numbers are frequently way too high, and occasionally way too low, and have been this way forever. I treat EPA ratings as having almost no basis in reality.
It’s rated at 28 highway, which it probably gets cruising at 55-60. Step it up to 75-85 cruising speeds that are more common on the interstate and you’ll be down in the low 20s.
Just slightly down, Highland Green Miata reports 31mpg highway, at i don’t know what speed. But considering my old 2008 Grand Caravan got 24-25mpg@80mph, I would be surprised if the 16 year newer Odyssey was worse. In fact, 3mpg better sounds like exactly what I’d expect.
I just bought a 2024 Odyssey 6 months ago. The Sienna is not marginally more expensive when it’s equally equipped- it’s a lot more expensive. And you can’t easily get your hands on one, either. I had my choice of Hondas and got it at a discount. I drove a current generation Sienna as a rental over 2000 miles and found it nice to drive but the interior felt flimsy and cheap. Here’s why, despite it’s age, I bought the Odyssey: 1. The second row seats come out. Some people don’t use this, but I do. Have had them completely out 3 times already. 2. For whatever reason the Sienna doesn’t see fit to put a 12V power outlet in the cargo area until you are at nearly the top trim level. All Odysseys have this. 3. While both have equal towing capacity, the Sienna’s OEM towing package is a joke. 1.25″ hitch vs the Odyssey’s nicely integrated 2″. 4. The Odyssey’s cargo area is flatter with the rear seats down and the 2nd row out. I have also found that the Odyssey’s fuel economy isn’t nearly as bad as the sticker suggests. I’m getting 24 around town and about 31 on the highway (depending on how I’m driving).
Agree Toyota tends to feel cheap compared to a par Honda (Accord vs Camry), but these things are also rugged as hell. Toyota interior materials do not wear out and they seem to have better overall rust protection.
I live in the salt belt and I just traded in a 14 year old Odyssey and it had no rust, so subjective, I guess.
our ’15 Oddy has barely no rust whatsoever too and we are in the rust belt also.
I’m in the Pittsburgh area, so snow and salt. Hondas seem to have more visible body rust than Toyota for given year. Our 2005 MDX has far more chassis rot than the wife’s 2007 Corolla and my 2014 Camry is almost clean.
Haven’t driven a Sienna or Odyssey, but you got the nail on the head about the second row.
The Sienna is infinitely more handsome, but I’d begrudgingly buy the Fugly Odyssey because I need my second row seats to be removable. Sure, nearly twice the gas mileage is great, but only marginally useful to me versus being able to haul stuff in the equivalent of a full size truck bed.
I currently drive a 20 year old Grand Caravan with 235k on the clock; it has it’s shakes and rattles, but it’ll get 24-25mpg on the highway while carrying heaps of cargo.
Or you can buy a Pacifica Hybrid and get the 30 MPG, removable second row, and never use gas around town.
Does it have a lot of recalls? Oh absolutely. But it also effectively has an 8 year powertrain warranty. Don’t buy a 2021, but they seem to have re-worked out the kinks for the ones new on lot now…or my 2018 is going strong.
I had a rental Pacifica for a week about a year ago and I loved it. That said, I’m just not willing to roll the dice on one; I can’t have it in the shop for a 1/3rd of the year due to recalls and other random Chrysler issues.
My luck with Chrysler has been very good so far, but I’ve also bought very cheap ($2k or less) and to spend “new car” money on a Chrysler just makes me worry.
Yea it sucks that the middle row doesn’t fold flat or come out. Despite that I still can haul full sheets of plywood and 12′ 2×4 for my home projects. It’s just takes some planning and some floor mats.
Isn’t it as simple as Honda doesn’t have a hybrid system large enough for their bigger/premium vehicles?
The Pilot and Passport aren’t hybrids either, the Accord hybrid is a low-end engine that wouldn’t be suited to a minivan, and Acura doesn’t have a hybrid at all.
This may be it. Toyota has been selling a V6 Hybrid Highlander for over a decade now and electrified the Sienna shortly after. I have an older Acura MDX and the fuel mileage is terrible.
The Highlander switched to the same four-cylinder hybrid setup with the current generation in 2020, although the V6 version lived on at Lexus for a bit. They do have the HybridMax 2.4T that seems to be more of its successor, but the PHEV Lexus TX actually uses the V6 which is maybe the first such use of it.
Honda did have a Sport Hybrid MDX in the prior gen paired with a 3.0L V6 and a DCT, but that was maybe not quite durable enough and/or just too complicated for Pilots and Odysseys.
The Passport, Pilot, Odyssey and the Ridgeline are platform mates, so when you will see one that’s hybridized, you will see the others hybridized in short order.
Packaging. Too much work to re-work this generation. They already stick the spare tire between the driver and passenger front seat – good luck finding a spot for the additional powertrain components without a full redesign. Next generation maybe.
Yup, I don’t envy the engineers and the compromises they make for packaging on minivans. For instance, the Pacifica PHEV doesn’t have 2nd row Stow-n-go because that’s where the batteries are located.
Had to google this. This is insane. Never seen that before. That is an interesting location. I keep thinking about how nice it would be to store beer.
2008-2020 Grand Caravans also do this. Stow and Go seating makes it pretty necessary, considering that the stow and go takes up the space where the spare would normally live.
It’s certainly interesting to get the wheel out. Probably better off as a secret beverage cooler.
Well because every new generation Odyssey lasts 10 years.